CoG Weight Loss Club

[Karak]

Originally Posted by diablopath

I am about 191 lbs, which is quite a bit more than I thought I was, and about 30 - 40 more than I'm comfortable with.

What's the best way to start losing weight? I can easily cut out soda and shit and just cut back to water and 2% milk (I can't function without milk), but food is kind of hard. I'm currently unemployed and live at home, so my father buys the food.

I can probably talk him into getting me a membership at our local wellness center, but I'm not really sure what I'd do there. I am interested in toning up a bit, but I'm not trying to become a body builder. I just want to lose a lot of the unnecessary fat and be able to go on runs without having a heart attack.

I'm not at all familiar with working out and being healthy, so I'm just not at all sure as to where I'd start. Advice?

Having willpower.
Cutting shit out won't do anything/or at least very much for you until you have the willpower the true desire to make a change. The world is filled with people with exercise bikes in their homes that aren't used, running machines that they never ran on, and eating fat free everything and sugar free everything. It takes more.
Find the core thing that feeds your desire to be in better shape and augment in it your mind. Focus on it and remind yourself every day of it. Just like remembering to lock your car, you remember that you don't want to be chubby anymore. It needs to become a part of you that is so strong that it is almost painful for you to deny it.
I have had 2 very very heavy times in my life and I found the most uncomfortable pics I could of those times and I have them with me. I have them in my gym and I have them in my wallet. They remind me of what I do not want to return to. Like a bad ex girlfriend who calls that I can hang up on, these pictures help me hang up on laziness and anything else that I begin to take to extremes.

Once that is done. I don't think giving you advice is the best bet here as it sounds like you need a good start to finish walk through.

Sounds like you need some real person knowledge so I would suggest getting a single 30 minute to 1 hour session with a training instructor and explain what you want to do. Forums are great, the Internet is amazing, but not even video's can teach you true proper form or answer your questions in a timely fashion (trust me, you should see people thinking they know martial arts from watching instructional videos

A person there with you can help you get a couple good core work outs. They can also be there to motivate you in person, help you when you are a bit down and further develop what you want to do as you progress. You can do it, you just have to find the willpower/desire to keep it up. Everyone can work out hard one-two days a week for a couple weeks than slack off. Its when someone does it for years on end that you know they have locked their sights on their desire for forward momentum.

Also you might think of a tiered program. Seems like that would work well for you.

That is where you pick either more exercise or something to cut from your diet(first) and let it sink in for 1-2 weeks than augment that with whatever you didn't change the first weeks.

For example:
Week 1-2: 2 mile walk 3 times in a period starting monday and ending sunday.
Week 3-4: 2 mile walk 3 times as normal but remove 1 snack 3 times a week starting monday and ending sunday
Week 5-6: 3 mile walk 3 times a week, same snack routine
Week 7-8: 3 mile walk 3 times a week, remove snack from all days
Week 9-10: Jog 1/2 mile then walk 3 miles, do this 4 times a week.

That would be for a slow start. But its tiered and alternates in 2 week sections from exercise to changing diet.

But again a trainer would be better able to see what works for you. Once meeting you in person and discussing injuries, your current physical abilities, your eating habits and many many other factors they can usually put something together for you.

[Karak]

Originally Posted by resikel

(What about diet soda? Zero calories! It's been suggested that diet soda will make the average person more hungry over the day so said person made end up eating more by day's end.)

This is something I really really worried about. I drink over a case of diet pepsi in half a day. Usually if playing games or airsoft with Ronin 2 cases for a total of 48 cans a day

But the case studies have shown that.
1 It doesn't foam up more in your stomach than normal pop so replacing it won't cause stomach stretching.

2 The chemical in "some" diet pops has shown that rats will begin to have dropped levels of one of the essential amino acids that help with metabolism but the amount dropped was about 10.000 to 1 compared to the intake of the chemical. However, humans and rats are different so it could have NO effect or it could have a way worse one

3 Humans suck Sorry I mean the stupid person effect. Supposedly if a person is what I term as an "eater" they just eat to eat. If they were counting calories and are introduced to a diet pop they WILL offset the missed calories with food as they see 0 calories and think "BONUS!". However, this can also be offset by replacing foods LOWER in calories and sugar than a normal cola still inducing a negative caloric intake through the day.

What does all this mean? You have to fucking control yourself no matter what Count calories, keep moving, have some fucking willpower and desire to improve and you will.

My own personal experience with all kinds of soda is that it doesn't do anything to hunger. Doesn't augment it nor help me get rid of it. That's just me. I got lucky that way.

[Serapth]

Damn dude, that is a dangerous amount of liquid to be drinking. 48 355ml cans? Thats 17 litres of pop a day, or 4.5 gallons. That is not healthy, regardless to the substance.

[Karak]

Originally Posted by Serapth

Damn dude, that is a dangerous amount of liquid to be drinking. 48 355ml cans? Thats 17 litres of pop a day, or 4.5 gallons. That is not healthy, regardless to the substance.

Ya I know. I hear it all the time. But...well I must have an oral fetish
I basically am drinking something all day long. What is strange is...so far I have no negative effect from it. This will be the 18th year in a row, with my early years more real pop than diet.

Kidneys are freaking awesome, liver awesome, heart awesome, lungs awesome, brain(corrupted by lack of human sensitivity but I can multitask like a motherfucker with pretty good accuracy). On the other hand here I am up since 4am...and its 2am and...I am not tired.
Then again I also sort of don't care. I had enough worrying when I was young and cancer almost ended me. Now its ME TIME! I just took it to the extreme I suppose

But I will say, your math actually gave me a freakish moment of pause. I am looking at a case of diet pepsi all empty, and 3 2 liters all empty and I am ALMOST done with the other 2 liter. Ya that's alot

Actually I may stop in fact. My wife and I are trying to save money and strangely diet cola has JUMPED in price. With my insane intake I am actually causing us to spend over 400 bucks a month in pop. Its 8.99 a 24 pack right now. We are discussing other things, because I get ill just drinking water. Ugh. Even the thought makes me ill. Last time I went cold turkey I didn't have any symptoms so I much just go cold turkey and switch to some of those flavored waters...at a far lower intake.

[Shieldmaiden]

Is there any particular reason you drink it in cans? Buying the larger bottles tends to be significantly cheaper.

[tacitus]

I remember hearing about a "if you use diet sweetners you will make up the calories later" study. What I recall about it was a fairly small randomized double-blind controlled study and it was a also a short study, but I do not remember its duration. The participants were given cookies or other desert product that were either made with sugar or diet and neither the participants nor the researchers knew what they were given. Then the participants kept a food diary. When the researchers counted the calories based on the food diaries those who had the eaten the diet cookies vs those who had eaten the normal cookies it appeared that the "diets" were making up the calories elsewhere.

If you are drinking 4 gallons of diet soda, it probably doesn't apply.

There are anecdotal "aspertane makes me depressed" reports. I actually fall into this category but I have to have like a can a day for a week for it to show up. Some studies have shown maybe and some have shown nay - don't remember any details on those. But if for some reason you decide to cut back, you might want to do it slowly because there might be some neurochemical funkiness going on.

[Purple Santa]

Originally Posted by tacitus

There are anecdotal "aspertane makes me depressed" reports. I actually fall into this category but I have to have like a can a day for a week for it to show up. Some studies have shown maybe and some have shown nay - don't remember any details on those. But if for some reason you decide to cut back, you might want to do it slowly because there might be some neurochemical funkiness going on.

Of course there is neurochemical funkiness going on. We are talking about Karak's brain. I would usually have the same concerns for anyone going cold turkey from such a high use of a substance but it's Karak. I don't think his brain registers withdrawal. Probably just register to feel the need to do his next decision leading to another Karak tale.

[Karak]

Originally Posted by BigJonno

Is there any particular reason you drink it in cans? Buying the larger bottles tends to be significantly cheaper.

One of my other posts I talk about 2 liters. I drink it from whatever, a good deal of times it just happens to be cans. But I don't want to switch away from cans just to 2 liter bottles. If I am going to switch it will be to lower it completely to save cash.

[Karak]

Originally Posted by tacitus

I remember hearing about a "if you use diet sweetners you will make up the calories later" study. What I recall about it was a fairly small randomized double-blind controlled study and it was a also a short study, but I do not remember its duration. The participants were given cookies or other desert product that were either made with sugar or diet and neither the participants nor the researchers knew what they were given. Then the participants kept a food diary. When the researchers counted the calories based on the food diaries those who had the eaten the diet cookies vs those who had eaten the normal cookies it appeared that the "diets" were making up the calories elsewhere.

If you are drinking 4 gallons of diet soda, it probably doesn't apply.

There are anecdotal "aspertane makes me depressed" reports. I actually fall into this category but I have to have like a can a day for a week for it to show up. Some studies have shown maybe and some have shown nay - don't remember any details on those. But if for some reason you decide to cut back, you might want to do it slowly because there might be some neurochemical funkiness going on.

Ya as I was saying. If the person is an "eater" they have an underlying issue that a diet ANYTHING won't fix. Even a low fat version will do the same thing. Humans are marvelous as self destruction.
Nah I have stopped cold turkey for 4 months due to cost and just...not being into it anymore and nothing happens. As for hos much I drink. I didn't always drink that much. Just over time.

Aspertane is like any chemical, vitamin, what have you. There is always going to be some effect. I know people who get depressed with the smallest amount of 100% natural sugar, people who can't eat anything very high fat or they pretty much stop digesting.
Everything you put in you has somekind of effect on you.

Santa you know me. I love or hate things. No middle ground...or very rarely. If I stop pop I will replace it with...something strange like even more reading or something not equal but somehow takes its place

[resikel]

Originally Posted by Karak

With my insane intake I am actually causing us to spend over 400 bucks a month in pop.

Let's put this in perspective for diablopath, who's trying to lose weight on a budget...

My current monthly food budget is approximately $450, of which, I think I can either reduce down to $300 as I am constantly evaluating many nutrition options and/or increase the quantity of food and still keep it at around $450.

Karak's monthly pop budget is $400.

[Narradisall]

Resikel, can I ask, do you just run 5k a day, 6-7 days a week? Also, outdoor running, or machine?

[resikel]

Originally Posted by Narradisall

Resikel, can I ask, do you just run 5k a day, 6-7 days a week? Also, outdoor running, or machine?

I run around my neighborhood and am limiting myself to 5K (3.15 miles) because I'm prone to blisters if I go longer. I may have to change shoes or get better specific socks for long distance running.

But increased cardio is not my goal. I run to build up my endurance which allow me to make it through the P90X workouts. I've only done 18 days worth (which took me 31 days) so far. In years past, when I tried P90X, I couldn't even last through the initial warming up stage. That's how bad my stamina was...and that failure resulted in me giving up completely.

Outdoor running vs Indoor machine:

1. Outdoor running is good if you're training for a running event/marathon as you will condition yourself to the actual conditions.

2. Indoor machine. Weather is not a factor. Less impact on your body means less prone to injuries.

There's an artificial feel when you are using a treadmill because of the cushioning bounciness of it's function but that's perfectly fine. Even if you are planning to run in an event, treadmilling is fine as long as you accumulate yourself to outdoor running at some point before the date.

For me, it's easier to put on my shorts, open the door, and start running rather than get in my car and drive to the gym. I would rather go to the gym but I currently can't commit to that.

I think I went off tangent a bit but the short answer is: (for me) In the beginning I did more cardio than weights. Now, with my stamina built up, I am adjusting my workout for increased weight training or rather better quality P90X workout results.

One final note that I think needs stating: post workout. Within 30 minutes I always would either eat a protein bar or drink a protein shake after my run and after my workout for optimal nutrition/muscle rebuilding.

[Karak]

Originally Posted by resikel

But increased cardio is not my goal. I run to build up my endurance which allow me to make it through the P90X workouts. I've only done 18 days worth (which took me 31 days) so far. In years past, when I tried P90X, I couldn't even last through the initial warming up stage. That's how bad my stamina was...and that failure resulted in me giving up completely.

FYI. I only got through P90x perfectly after tracking at 8 miles a day 5 days a week. P90X is brutal at times. I used the treadmill for lungs as I don't like the way it does some of the work for you, and did tons of hill sprints. Man P90X STILL was so hard even after that. A damn good program.

On your final note about food, were you balancing that? Snacks are great after a workout if you haven't preloaded. Is that what your doing?

For me I run on an empty stomach. I find my energy and my stamina far in excess than when I have eaten. Snacks afterward for rebuilding gly levels and getting my system started back up again from flight or fight mode.

But when lifting weights I eat before working out. I have a habit of working legs very very hard which usually makes people throw up. So having some food in your stomach can usually stop that. God I hate that feeling

[Karak]

Originally Posted by resikel

Let's put this in perspective for diablopath, who's trying to lose weight on a budget...

My current monthly food budget is approximately $450, of which, I think I can either reduce down to $300 as I am constantly evaluating many nutrition options and/or increase the quantity of food and still keep it at around $450.

Karak's monthly pop budget is $400.

Awesome pic. My monthly food bill is less than yours though If you don't count that fucking pop hahahahaha.

[resikel]

Originally Posted by Karak

FYI. I only got through P90x perfectly after tracking at 8 miles a day 5 days a week. P90X is brutal at times. I used the treadmill for lungs as I don't like the way it does some of the work for you, and did tons of hill sprints. Man P90X STILL was so hard even after that. A damn good program.

On your final note about food, were you balancing that? Snacks are great after a workout if you haven't preloaded. Is that what your doing?

For me I run on an empty stomach. I find my energy and my stamina far in excess than when I have eaten. Snacks afterward for rebuilding gly levels and getting my system started back up again from flight or fight mode.

But when lifting weights I eat before working out. I have a habit of working legs very very hard which usually makes people throw up. So having some food in your stomach can usually stop that. God I hate that feeling

First off, there are days where I want to punch Tony Horton through my TV. The workouts are definitely brutal...sadistic at times.

And yes, the running has taught me to breath more efficiently for sure.

This past 2 months, I've been eating 6 times a day (every 2.5 hours):
1. Breakfast - protein shake
2. Snack - protein bar
3. Lunch - a meal that has at least 20g protein
4. Snack - protein bar
5. Dinner - protein shake
6. Snack - last snack of the day is usually something lite like yogurt

I fit the running and workouts in between so when I'm done, I would be eating something for the recovery.

So I've been eating on average about 1500 calories and 120g-130g protein per day.

I am currently re-evaluating this because I actually should be eating about 2000-2400 calories and raising my protein intake to around 160g. And I also need to raise my complex carb intake. So I will probably add at least one more meal into my routine.

Each protein shake, or meal replacement shakes, cost me $3.54. I've done some research and just bought another brand to try out. The new shakes' cost? $.80 cents. So I am definitely cost conscious as I'm moving forward in this endeavor.

All of this, I am learning as I go along. And as I have said previously, I've made many mistakes but that's OK, failing is part of the learning process.

[Karak]

Originally Posted by resikel

First off, there are days where I want to punch Tony Horton through my TV. The workouts are definitely brutal...sadistic at times.

I am currently re-evaluating this because I actually should be eating about 2000-2400 calories and raising my protein intake to around 160g. And I also need to raise my complex carb intake. So I will probably add at least one more meal into my routine.


All of this, I am learning as I go along. And as I have said previously, I've made many mistakes but that's OK, failing is part of the learning process.

Ya making mistakes means you are doing stuff So many don't.
As for calories. Ya 15-1600 is great for leaning down as long as you really watch that your not trimming too much muscle but gaining it can be a bitch. Because anything in excess can at some point turn to fat. What I did(because I didn't want to gain ANYTHING but fat.
I tapered up every 2 weeks. I started lifting as normal but only added 300 calories a day to my diet. I watched weights, saw if I was improving and so forth. Then the next 2 weeks I upped it another 300. Until I could figure out what I needed and not an arbitrary number.

For me 3200 is what I need for running 5 days and lifting 4 days and martial arts every day.
Just lifting is about 2400 unless I am trying to reach a personal best. My benchpress and leg press personal best times were maybe 3500 calories needed to really just add solid muscle and lifting 2 times a day morning and night. Bulk muscles need some serious fuel
Sounds like your getting everything in total order which rocks. So many people ignore this shit.

And as for P90x. Ya. We used to have 11 position random exercise day at the dojo and go for 2 hours and I swear P90X is VERY fucking close to that hard. But when you even pass one of the courses your like. "SCORE!"

[resikel]

Originally Posted by Karak

I tapered up every 2 weeks. I started lifting as normal but only added 300 calories a day to my diet. I watched weights, saw if I was improving and so forth. Then the next 2 weeks I upped it another 300. Until I could figure out what I needed and not an arbitrary number.

Shitballs! I never thought about that. I had it in my head that I needed to jump from 1500 to 2400 straight! And that scares me!

I'm gonna taper up to 1800 starting tomorrow and re-evaluate in about 10-14 days. Thanks Karak!

[Karak]

Originally Posted by resikel

Shitballs! I never thought about that. I had it in my head that I needed to jump from 1500 to 2400 straight! And that scares me!

I'm gonna taper up to 1800 starting tomorrow and re-evaluate in about 10-14 days. Thanks Karak!

Honestly I think that tapering is a lost art. The world is extremes now Sometimes those who get the best results do it surprisingly slowly. I also taper down by 2 week intervals and it worked wonders. No hunger, no sudden muscle loss and it allowed me to adjust my ratios of food to keep muscle on.

[resikel]

For anyone that has an iPhone and am thinking of running, the Nike+ GPS is free right now (first time that this is free and limited time only)(was $.99)

I put this in this thread because I use something similar to track my running (iPod Nano plus Nike+ combo) and it's a great way to track your progress.



-COMPATIBILITY REQUIREMENTS: The Nike+ GPS App is compatible with iPhone 3GS, iPhone 4 and iPod touch (2nd, 3rd, and 4th generations) running iOS 4.0 or later.

- Some features such as Share Run and Cheer Me On require users to be connected to a wireless network for full functionality. Note that iPod touch does not support GPS functionality. Also, please note that continued use of GPS running in the background can dramatically decrease battery life.

[Karak]

Very cool!
EDIT: uhm...6/19