Windows 7 RC: Who's installing it?

[Crittias]

I've been running beta (7000) on the laptop for a few weeks and been reasonably pleased: the chipset on the laptop doesnt' support Aero, so I'm not getting all the bells and whistles, but the OS runs fast, and battery life seems significantly improved over XP.

I'm downloading the 64-bit version of the RC now, which I'm planning on installing on my desktop to try out (on a spare hard drive).

Anyone else giving W7 a whirl?

[Goronmon]

It's running at home as my main OS. Been going fine since Saturday.

[Stoke]

Plan on installing it on my machine as soon as I get the time. Probably this weekend.

[H.Bogard]

Downloaded a few days back, the x64 setup doesn't run from WinXP 32! :mad:

I'll be backing up, formatting and installing later this night or tomorrow.

[Voodoo]

My IT department is all downloading it right now. We are going to evaluate it and see if it is a better option than continued use of Windows XP.

[biosc1]

Sitting on the 32 and 64 bit versions at the moment. One of my co-workers is going to give the 64-bit version a try while I install the 32 bit version :)

Maybe I'll even do it today, if I'm feeling bored. I played with the previous release on a spare machine, but didn't really use it all that much.

[Telefrog]

Using it on a few office machines now. No problems so far.

[NoName]

Haha, I tried installing it on my living room computer and the HD went bad during the install. I'll be trying again when the new parts I ordered come in.

At least the HD went bad after I had everything already backed up for the install :).

[MachEnergy]

I've been using the RC Build 7100 for a little over a week, and I absolutely love it. Previously I had Vista w/SP1 on my machine, so it doesn't take a whole lot of getting used to, being that it's pretty much Vista.

LOVE the new task bar!!! The way it handles pinned programs, grouping multiple windows, mousing over them for previews, previewing and/or easily going to the desktop, grouping task tray icons into a submenu......so clean....so functional. This is the kind of functional update I would have expected in Vista. Glad to see this now rather than not at all.

My only complaint with the installation was that the OS didn't recognize my 2nd SATA drive. I had to go to:

Control Panel -> Administrative Tools - > Computer Management...
in there choose 'Storage' -> 'Disk Management'

I found that my 2nd HDD didn't have a drive letter assigned to it. It was as simple as setting the label and I immediately had access to my data again.

[Wraith]

I'm still running the Beta at home (though I still boot into XP more often than not). I should probably install the RC, but I'm not sure on something, so I may as well ask...

My PC has XP Pro installed on a SATA drive. I added in an IDE drive and installed Win7 Beta on that. When I boot, the boot mgr lets me select Win7 (default) or Previous Version of Windows (XP Pro). So I assume it's using the Win7 boot loader. Is the MBR still on my SATA drive, or on the IDE drive? If I reformat the IDE drive (before doing a clean RC install), would I wipe out the MBR and screw things up so I can't boot? I want to leave my XP install intact and usable.

[Jackel]

I'm running the RC now as my primary OS. Loving it too and so far no major problems or conflicts that I can see.

Only thing I've noticed is that their are a few more clipping errors when playing as infected in Left 4 Dead.

[Vector]

Has anyone tried the XP mode?

I have a few legacy apps that didn't work under Vista and I'm curious if the XP mode will work for me.

[BlackPete]

Still running 7000 at home and it's been pretty sweet so far... which surprised the hell out of me because I couldn't even install a vanilla version of XP of my Dell laptop -- I had to use Dell's proprietary version of XP to get it working.

For those of you who went from 7000 to RC... have you seen any major differences between these versions?

[total]

Has anyone tried the XP mode?

I have a few legacy apps that didn't work under Vista and I'm curious if the XP mode will work for me.

I do not believe that has been released yet.

[Satertek]

Just finished downloading, using this edit (http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/archive/2009/04/07/delivering-a-quality-upgrade-experience.aspx) to upgrade my build 7000. Normally I'd just do a clean install, but I've got way too much crap installed, and I'm not in the mood to spend hours reinstalling everything (or spending even longer trying to get the registry just right so I don't have to reinstall). Hopefully it goes as smoothly as my Vista->build 7000 upgrade went.

[cp#]

Been using 7100 for a week or two on my laptop. It's nice.

[torrefaction]

I can't wait for the RTM, so I can finally switch my production box.

[H.Bogard]

Posting from a fresh install right now. Its pretty good, I like how there's so many handy visual indicators on the new dock-like taskbar now. Little things like overlapping buttons equating to the amount of windows opened within the specific program, as well as copying/installing progress being shown on the icons is pretty nifty.

My gripe is that I've been unable to hunt down proper drivers for my Nforce 6 mobo thus far. Hopefully MS and NVidia will ship out some betas soon.

Anyone got some handy tips and tricks to share? I like how the Show Desktop button is at the bottom right of the screen now, very easy to jump to.

[Lance Uppercut]

Will this run on my netbook? What are the system requirements?

[torrefaction]

Will this run on my netbook? What are the system requirements?

Almost certainly. I've ever heard it runs decent on 1GB of RAM.

“1GHz or faster 32-bit (x86) or 64-bit (x64) processor;
1 GB of RAM (32-bit)/2 GB of RAM (64-bit);
16 GB of available disk space (32-bit)/20 GB (64-bit);
DirectX 9 graphics device with Windows Display Driver Model 1.0 or higher driver,"

[Lance Uppercut]

My puny Eee 700 only has 4GB of disk space, so I guess that's a no :(

[H.Bogard]

My puny Eee 700 only has 4GB of disk space, so I guess that's a no :(

Yeah, Ultimate x64 takes up around 9 gigs on my drive.

[J Arcane]

I wanna try it, bad. Probably will download it, and see if I can't scrounge a spare drive for the install, as I don't wanna risk the main drive on an unknown.

How is 64-bit support in 7? Is it finally worth just running in 64-bit mode, or is it still a mess of headaches and bad drivers?

[torrefaction]

I wanna try it, bad. Probably will download it, and see if I can't scrounge a spare drive for the install, as I don't wanna risk the main drive on an unknown.

How is 64-bit support in 7? Is it finally worth just running in 64-bit mode, or is it still a mess of headaches and bad drivers?

64-bit was worth running in Vista, so I can't imagine that's changed with 7.

[Jackel]

64bit works fine for me. No problems here.

[total]

I don't see any reason to run 32-bit anymore. I have had absolutely no issues running 64.

[total]

My gripe is that I've been unable to hunt down proper drivers for my Nforce 6 mobo thus far. Hopefully MS and NVidia will ship out some betas soon.

I stopped buying Nvidia products because of their shoddy chipset support. I gave up on them when I was trying to use an AGP card with an Nforce3 chipset and a X2 processor in Vista. The only way to get it running was to disable one of the cores on the processor. That sealed the deal for me. No more Nvidia products.

[H.Bogard]

I stopped buying Nvidia products because of their shoddy chipset support. I gave up on them when I was trying to use an AGP card with an Nforce3 chipset and a X2 processor in Vista. The only way to get it running was to disable one of the cores on the processor. That sealed the deal for me. No more Nvidia products.

I just downloaded and installed the Vista 64 driver package, works fine. :)

But yeah, Nvidia's drivers aren't exactly the best. My ATI days were much more pleasant.

[Wraith]

Has anyone tried the XP mode?

I have a few legacy apps that didn't work under Vista and I'm curious if the XP mode will work for me.I do not believe that has been released yet.Windows XP Mode Beta (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=0e8fa9b3-c236-4b77-be26-173f032f5159)

[Vector]

Windows XP Mode Beta (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=0e8fa9b3-c236-4b77-be26-173f032f5159)

Much appreciation!

[Troggles]

About to install the 64 bit myself. I tried the beta and had quite a few problems (32 bit) but I think they were ironed out. I want to upgrade to 7 when it releases and would like to make the jump to 64 bit asap.

[Mot Wakorb]

I'm running 64-bit Vista on two machines right now - no issues. Driver support can be hard to find for obscure hardware (Serial to USB adapter, I'm looking at you), but past that it's no issue at all. General driver support has come a long way.

[Shadowstorm]

Windows XP Mode Beta (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=0e8fa9b3-c236-4b77-be26-173f032f5159)

Thanks a lot for this! I was not aware this was even in Beta form yet.

[Disgustipated]

I think I'll put the RTM on my laptop. I'd like the rest of the bugs to be worked out before I finally give it a thorough trial run.

[J Arcane]

I have installed it. Put it on a third partition I made from the free space I made on my second.

So far no glaring issues really, but I've only been monkeying with it for like 15 minutes or so. Installation was a breeze.

[Ancalagon]

You know....

I was read this (http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3557) today, an article about W7 RC1. And I got to thinking, whats the difference between Windows 7 and a new Ubuntu release?

I mean, each Ubuntu release includes new programs, new hardware support, better optimization of boot speed, optimized GUI, heck the latest version includes a new filesystem.

I guess what I'm saying is that I think in some cases W7 is going to be a hard sell, because it isnt much more than an upgraded Vista. Now, it may be upgraded enough to be worth purchasing, especially for those who still own XP, but compared to a free Ubuntu its a bitter pill to swallow. I want some of the features of 7, but to be honest I cant see myself paying for them, especially since a lot of them should be available for Vista. Such as WMP12, DX11, DX2D, GDI+ partial acceleration etc.

Yeah, if you need to play games you have no option but Vista, granted. But for everything else, I think its getting harder and harder for MS to convince people its worth paying for Windows. If I didnt play games, I'm not sure I'd be willing to hand over the price of a Radeon 4770 for an OEM copy of Windows. If I was just browsing the net, playing music etc, Ubuntu does all of that and saves me £80.

[Vandabo]

My laptop was able to run Vista, but not that well. Is windows 7 any easier on the hardware? I liked vista but everything took longer than it did under XP, so I switched back. If windows 7 can achieve the niceties of vista without the huge speed drain I would install it in a heartbeat.

[Crittias]

My laptop was able to run Vista, but not that well. Is windows 7 any easier on the hardware? I liked vista but everything took longer than it did under XP, so I switched back. If windows 7 can achieve the niceties of vista without the huge speed drain I would install it in a heartbeat.To keep it brief: yes, W7 is friendlier to older/slower hardware like laptops. I'd suggest giving the RC a try.

[MachEnergy]

Anyone got some handy tips and tricks to share? I like how the Show Desktop button is at the bottom right of the screen now, very easy to jump to.

I like how the application icons in the task bar have a glow that moves around as your mouse cursor hovers from one side to the other. I typically prefer function over form, but this aesthetic is still pretty cool.

You can use Win+Tab to cycle through open windows just you would a 3D rolodex, and you can click on any of those stacked screens to be instantly taken to it. Or, use your scroll wheel to flip through them. This functionality is even defaulted to my Logitech mouse's middle thumb button. This is a great Vista feature, but if you haven't used Vista, it's still a much cooler method that Alt+Tab that you should know about.

The only other thing I can think of is something you've probably already done. When an application has multiple windows open, they are stacked below the application's icon in the task bar. If you mouse over the icon, it will display a small preview of each window. If you then mouse over any preview window, it will show you the actual window as the only thing displayed over the desktop. At this point, you can then click the preview window to be taken to the actual one. Alternately, each preview window has a close button, so you can easily close windows you don't need open just by hovering over the master icon and then clicking the [X] on any window you want closed.

[Vector]

You know....

I was read this (http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3557) today, an article about W7 RC1. And I got to thinking, whats the difference between Windows 7 and a new Ubuntu release?

I mean, each Ubuntu release includes new programs, new hardware support, better optimization of boot speed, optimized GUI, heck the latest version includes a new filesystem.

I guess what I'm saying is that I think in some cases W7 is going to be a hard sell, because it isnt much more than an upgraded Vista. Now, it may be upgraded enough to be worth purchasing, especially for those who still own XP, but compared to a free Ubuntu its a bitter pill to swallow. I want some of the features of 7, but to be honest I cant see myself paying for them, especially since a lot of them should be available for Vista. Such as WMP12, DX11, DX2D, GDI+ partial acceleration etc.

Yeah, if you need to play games you have no option but Vista, granted. But for everything else, I think its getting harder and harder for MS to convince people its worth paying for Windows. If I didnt play games, I'm not sure I'd be willing to hand over the price of a Radeon 4770 for an OEM copy of Windows. If I was just browsing the net, playing music etc, Ubuntu does all of that and saves me £80.

Luckily for MS enough people buy new notebooks and PCs each year that before you know it millions will have "upgraded" to W7.

Plus a lot of people skipped Vista so it's not like MS is forcing them to upgrade yet again since XP.

Ubuntu might be free but in many ways so is W7 since you can't really buy the latest Dell without an OS.

[Ancalagon]

Ubuntu might be free but in many ways so is W7 since you can't really buy the latest Dell without an OS.

Its not free at all, MS still gets a cut. Sell the same laptop without Windows and with Ubuntu instead, you will pay a lower price.

[Slack3r78]

You can use Win+Tab to cycle through open windows just you would a 3D rolodex, and you can click on any of those stacked screens to be instantly taken to it. Or, use your scroll wheel to flip through them. This functionality is even defaulted to my Logitech mouse's middle thumb button. This is a great Vista feature, but if you haven't used Vista, it's still a much cooler method that Alt+Tab that you should know about.
Meh, useless eyecandy.

[MachEnergy]

Meh, useless eyecandy.

Really? I find it to be far more functional that Alt+Tab. You can click on the window (or your desktop) and be taken to it.

Edit: I didn't realize you can click on the icons in the Alt+Tab view. You couldn't do that in XP and I never tried in Vista.

So yeah, it's really about the same. Except the Win+Tab view lets you see the contents of each window and not just an icon with the window title text. To each his own.

[Wraith]

You know....

I was read this (http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3557) today, an article about W7 RC1. And I got to thinking, whats the difference between Windows 7 and a new Ubuntu release?
I'm still running XP, same copy I've had since 2003. If I had gotten Vista recently, I might be a bit more hesitant to shell out for 7. For those who have Vista, I guess their buying decision depends on whether 7 offers them anything they really need/want that they can't get from their current OS. I'm sure a lot of these people will stick with Vista, especially if it's working well for them. (And Vista will still be supported by MS.)
As already mentioned, there are still going to be new PC sales, which will start shipping with 7 instead of Vista. They'll certainly sell a lot of copies to OEMs.
People stick with Windows for familiarity. Yes, there are alternatives for most Windows applications, but they still require the user to relearn what they already know how to do in their usual App. Windows 7 will, for the most part, run all the applications that someone was running under Vista or XP. And people who have paid money for Windows software (not everything is free software) want to be able to use it.
And like you mentioned, games. Even for more casual gamers, this can be an issue. Sims 3 requires a Windows or Mac OS.
Does Ubuntu work well with iPods, Zunes? I'd imagine that it's not quite as easy as under Windows.

[total]

Does Ubuntu work well with iPods, Zunes? I'd imagine that it's not quite as easy as under Windows.

Not sure about a Zune, but iPods work better in Ubuntu IMHO. I don't need fucking iTunes to bloat up my system for me. I'm not sure if there is support for the newer ipods or the touch but my Gen 5 (I think) worked flawlessly.

[Slack3r78]

Really? I find it to be far more functional that Alt+Tab. You can click on the window (or your desktop) and be taken to it.

Edit: I didn't realize you can click on the icons in the Alt+Tab view. You couldn't do that in XP and I never tried in Vista.

So yeah, it's really about the same. Except the Win+Tab view lets you see the contents of each window and not just an icon with the window title text. To each his own.
It's a poor presentation of the information involved.

Aero Peek is actually useful. WinFlip is poorly implemented garbage.

[Ancalagon]

It wont work with iPods without hacks, unless Apple release an iTunes for Linux which we all know it well never do (despite the fact that its Mac OS is at least partially based on Unix). As for Zunes... depends on whether Zunes are as closed as iPods are or support that protocol that most other MP3 players support (the one that lets them work with Winamp, windows media player, etc etc).

Yeah, I'm not saying that Linux is a cakewalk, it is different. It has its own quirks etc. But the point is I think its becoming more difficult for MS to convince people to shell out for the latest and greatest windows when they paid an exhorbitant amount of money for their last copy as little as 1-2 years ago. in the state that Linux was in for most of the 90's, yeah I'd agree it was hardly a consumer ready OS. But now with Fedora and Ubuntu both releasing every 6 months like clockwork and producing pretty damn good OS's, I start to wonder what is it that makes Windows worth the MASSIVE price premium.

Other than games of any sort, I'll agree.

I almost certainly wont upgrade from Vista.

[J Arcane]

:( Can't get classic Fallout to work. Not even in compatibility mode. Going to try the XP Mode Beta.

[GigaFuzz]

Installed it. No problems, but then I didn't have any with build 7000 either. Nicest change so far: the pretty wallpapers. Shame they still chose a pretty boring one as default.

[J Arcane]

:( Can't get classic Fallout to work. Not even in compatibility mode. Going to try the XP Mode Beta.
XP Mode is fail. It's just a version of Virtual PC with a free copy of XP. It's fairly slow on my rig, I don't even think it'd be fast enough to handle Fallout comfortably. And I can't get it to access my optical drives, at least, not the virtual one I need.

This makes the first Windows OS I've used that couldn't run this game. :(

[Wraith]

How many Intel CPUs will fail the XP Mode test in Windows 7? (http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=946) (ZDNet)

[total]

It wont work with iPods without hacks, unless Apple release an iTunes for Linux which we all know it well never do (despite the fact that its Mac OS is at least partially based on Unix).

This isn't true at all. Here is what I had to do to use my 60GB Gen 5.



sudo apt-get install gtkpod
type password
plug in ipod


There is no hacking involved there. If you have a newer ipod (I think anything past a Gen 6) or a touch I don't think gtkpod works.

[total]

XP Mode is fail. It's just a version of Virtual PC with a free copy of XP.

Which is exactly what they said it would be. They also said that if your CPU doesn't support virtualization you are going to see pretty poor performance. Which CPU do you have?

[J Arcane]

Which is exactly what they said it would be. They also said that if your CPU doesn't support virtualization you are going to see pretty poor performance. Which CPU do you have?
Athlon X2 3800+ AM2, which according to my information should support virtualization. Virtual XP actually won't run with out it, according to the website.

I guess I was just mislead by the article I'd read about it, suggested it was a somewhat more transparent method of use. That part doesn't bother me so much, other than that the performance is quite terrible on my rig.

[muddi900]

Anyone got some handy tips and tricks to share? I like how the Show Desktop button is at the bottom right of the screen now, very easy to jump to.

It is very nifty but very obsolete. I pin most of my regularly used programs to the task bar:

http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo299/muddi900/taskbar.jpg

It has a nifty feature that when you press win+[number], the corresponding program on the task is opened. For example if I press win+1, the calculator will open. you can rearrange it to your liking.

you can also pin programs to the Start(win?) menu:
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo299/muddi900/startmenu.png
Yes, the witcher works perfectly with it.

and start win+[typing] for launching applications that you don't regularly use.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo299/muddi900/startpaint.jpg

Oh the paint is awesome for basic editing. No need to wait for Photoshop or Paint.net to load. I hope it's extendable so some crazy bastard can add layers to it. That would be awesome.

Also, google win7 calculator features.

I still haven't tried the RC, I need to figure out a way to update from the beta. I know there is a way It also seems that I'm incapable of running XP mode.:)

[J Arcane]

The Mac lover in me can't help but point out that the two features you point out muddi are all ready in OSX, but it's still nice seeing them in Windows anyway. ;)

[BlackPete]

So yeah, it's really about the same. Except the Win+Tab view lets you see the contents of each window and not just an icon with the window title text. To each his own.

That was added in RC: http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/archive/2009/02/26/some-changes-since-beta.aspx

I'll take that over win-tab any day.

[total]

Athlon X2 3800+ AM2, which according to my information should support virtualization. Virtual XP actually won't run with out it, according to the website.

I guess I was just mislead by the article I'd read about it, suggested it was a somewhat more transparent method of use. That part doesn't bother me so much, other than that the performance is quite terrible on my rig.

Yeah I had that processor and did some virtual boxing with it and was never that impressed. My C2D is leaps and bounds above it in that department. Which chipset is driving that CPU of yours? I never made it to the AM2 platform because of my strong distaste for the end of life 939 motherboards.

I think the transparency is intended to be in there, it just might not be in there yet. The article I read made it sound more like running Wine in Linux, where you would just launch the app and it would run itself in XP mode. Here is to hoping.

[J Arcane]

Yeah I had that processor and did some virtual boxing with it and was never that impressed. My C2D is leaps and bounds above it in that department. Which chipset is driving that CPU of yours? I never made it to the AM2 platform because of my strong distaste for the end of life 939 motherboards.

I think the transparency is intended to be in there, it just might not be in there yet. The article I read made it sound more like running Wine in Linux, where you would just launch the app and it would run itself in XP mode. Here is to hoping.
Dunno what chipset, it's a handmedown Dell I got from a friend, and finding that sort of information is kinda tricky.

And yeah, we must've read the same article, because that was sort of the impression I'd gotten as well.

[muddi900]

You know....

I was read this (http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3557) today, an article about W7 RC1. And I got to thinking, whats the difference between Windows 7 and a new Ubuntu release?

I mean, each Ubuntu release includes new programs, new hardware support, better optimization of boot speed, optimized GUI, heck the latest version includes a new filesystem.

I guess what I'm saying is that I think in some cases W7 is going to be a hard sell, because it isnt much more than an upgraded Vista. Now, it may be upgraded enough to be worth purchasing, especially for those who still own XP, but compared to a free Ubuntu its a bitter pill to swallow. I want some of the features of 7, but to be honest I cant see myself paying for them, especially since a lot of them should be available for Vista. Such as WMP12, DX11, DX2D, GDI+ partial acceleration etc.

Yeah, if you need to play games you have no option but Vista, granted. But for everything else, I think its getting harder and harder for MS to convince people its worth paying for Windows. If I didnt play games, I'm not sure I'd be willing to hand over the price of a Radeon 4770 for an OEM copy of Windows. If I was just browsing the net, playing music etc, Ubuntu does all of that and saves me £80.

It is a significantly better OS than XP, and what I saw of Vista. Ubuntu is a great piece of software, but I don't need it. I game on my windows install and do all my work and entertainment on it as well. There is no need fror me to use another OS. Your argument would be valid if it weren't a gaming forum. But it is.

If you're happy with vista, then you don't need to shell out the money for it, but I have been using windows 7 as my main OS for a few months now and I will happily switch when the time comes. You should give it a try as well, since it's free now.

The Mac lover in me can't help but point out that the two features you point out muddi are all ready in OSX, but it's still nice seeing them in Windows anyway. ;)

The windows lover in me would point out that I paid less for it and get better performance. ;)

[J Arcane]

The windows lover in me would point out that I paid less for it and get better performance.

My Mac I built for free from spare parts, and ran OS X like a dream, but choked on basic internet surfing under Win7.

Don't go getting any illusions about this thing now. It's a great thing, and it's definitely less of a performance hog than Vista was, but it ain't exactly QNX either.

[BlackPete]

Sniff, sniff, I smell a PC/Mac/Linux war.... quick, time to break out this pic:

http://news.cnet.com/i/bto/20070322/1157960476967.jpg

Hopefully that will silence any possibilities of this war. :D

[J Arcane]

Well, see, I was also going to point out that a lot of the new features are in Linux as well, so does that simultaneously make me cool, young, hip, and a spandex clad fatbeard?

[total]

Ubuntu is a great piece of software, but I don't need it. I game on my windows install and do all my work and entertainment on it as well.

Which is exactly how I feel at this point. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love my Ubuntu 8.10 install, but I don't use it as much since I got my new PC. I find that a lot of the applications I loved in Linux have comparable Windows alternatives. I spend a ton more time actually gaming on my PC in 7 and I love it. They are both fine operating systems in my eyes, but with different purposes. For me, 7 is for gaming (and I do a ton of it on there now) and Ubuntu is for Eclipse and Netbeans.

[Slack3r78]

I like how the Show Desktop button is at the bottom right of the screen now, very easy to jump to.
Somebody at Microsoft finally found out about Fitts' Law.

[H.Bogard]

Gee, I wonder which OS is better? The one that supports almost every bit of hardware under the Sun? Or a semi-closed platform with an Apple logo on everything that can't even run games?




and start win+[typing] for launching applications that you don't regularly use.


That feature was always in Vista, too.

[Shadowstorm]

Would anyone be willing to help me out?

I've been trying to burn the 64 bit Windows 7 RC that I got directly from Microsoft.com for a couple days now. I've used several ISO burning programs and none seem to be working. I have gone into the BIOS to make sure that the CD/DVD ROM drive boot priority is first, then the HDDs, but to no avail. I've used a couple DVD-Rs and I'd like to get this sorted out before I try again.

I haven't had this problem before. Just weird.

[cp#]

Use ImgBurn. Use a blank DVD. Dunno what else to say.

[Shadowstorm]

Use ImgBurn. Use a blank DVD. Dunno what else to say.

I did that. I also tried Nero, InfraRecorder, and CDBurnerXP.

I'm at a loss.

[Wraith]

I did that. I also tried Nero, InfraRecorder, and CDBurnerXP.

I'm at a loss.http://www.computerhope.com/issues/ch000217.htm

Or maybe the downloaded file was bad? (Or would that have shown up when trying to burn the ISO?)

[Crittias]

IsoRecorder (http://isorecorder.alexfeinman.com/Vista.htm) is also a possibility.

[Slack3r78]

Gee, I wonder which OS is better? The one that supports almost every bit of hardware under the Sun? Or a semi-closed platform with an Apple logo on everything that can't even run games?
Depends on what you're doing. OS X = UNIX with a pretty UI on top. That's the draw. There are things I loathe even attempting on Windows that aren't a big deal on a Mac or Linux box.

That feature was always in Vista, too.
No. Nothing good ever came out of Vista. Vista is ME 2.0.

[H.Bogard]

No. Nothing good ever came out of Vista. Vista is ME 2.0.


Considering I'd been using it since SP1's release right until 7's RC1 came out, I beg to differ.

Or is that sarcasm? God, my meter sucks!

[total]

Gee, I wonder which OS is better? The one that supports almost every bit of hardware under the Sun? Or a semi-closed platform with an Apple logo on everything that can't even run games?

The one that will do what you want it to do in the manner you prefer would be my guess. If I can get it for free, all the better.

[J Arcane]

The one that will do what you want it to do in the manner you prefer would be my guess. If I can get it for free, all the better.
Personally, if there were more software support for it, I'd be running QNX just for the speed. :D


On a more serious note, I have a question of sorts for the Win7 gurus. On my XP setups, I use a two partition system. One 20GB partition for the OS and basic apps, and then the rest of the drive for games, documents, media, etc. One facet of this strategy's usability hinges upon a particular feature of XP, where I can change the target folder of the My Documents link to something other than the default location, in this case, to one created on my second partition.

However, I can't seem to find anywhere to do this on Win7. Am I correct in assuming this functionality is no longer available?

[H.Bogard]

You can customize your libraries folders.

[J Arcane]

You can customize your libraries folders.
I know that, but it doesn't have the same effect.

A lot of games and such store settings in the My Documents folder. One of the nice things about keeping it on the same drives as the games, is that when I reformat, I just remap the MyDocs back to that old folder, and everything's already in the right place, and any games that used that folder still even have the same settings and everything.

Yes I could back up by hand each time, but it's much easier this way.

[Vector]

No. Nothing good ever came out of Vista. Vista is ME 2.0.

Assuming you're not being sarcastic...

Unlike 64bit XP, Vista actually let me use 4gigs+ AND the apps I own.

64bit XP had all sorts of compatibility issues ranging from hardware to software. It never worked with my video card and many of my games crashed under it.

Vista was the superior 64bit OS.

[total]

I did that. I also tried Nero, InfraRecorder, and CDBurnerXP.

I'm at a loss.

Do you have a 4GB USB stick lying around?

[Shadowstorm]

Do you have a 4GB USB stick lying around?

Actually, I found what the problem was - it seems the download got corrupted. When I run the copy that I got from Microsoft.com in VMware, VMware says Operating System Not Found / Corrupted (something to that effect). When I run the same build in VMware that I got from torrents, it works fine.

So I am just going to use the torrent version and use a beta key from Microsoft.com.

[Slack3r78]

Yes, the biggest Vista proponent on this forum thinks it's bullshit.

M-E MOTHER FUCKING TWO POINT OH.

[Slack3r78]

So I am just going to use the torrent version and use a beta key from Microsoft.com.
lol, it's like torrents have error-correction or some shit.

[Crittias]

One facet of this strategy's usability hinges upon a particular feature of XP, where I can change the target folder of the My Documents link to something other than the default location, in this case, to one created on my second partition.

However, I can't seem to find anywhere to do this on Win7. Am I correct in assuming this functionality is no longer available?Here are instructions for Vista, I don't know if they still hold for W7:
http://www.edbott.com/weblog/?p=1371

[J Arcane]

Here are instructions for Vista, I don't know if they still hold for W7:
http://www.edbott.com/weblog/?p=1371
Ahh, yeah it's the same. You can still do what you could in XP, sort of, it's just now you have to do it for each individual subfolder, and the structure's a bit different from before.

[Ancalagon]

You should give it a try as well, since it's free now.

Meh, I dont like bait and switch. I'd need to pay for it if I wanted to continue using it once the beta expires. No thanks.

[Crittias]

Meh, I dont like bait and switch.I don't think bait and switch is a fair term for the beta program. It's more like a shareware model: try our software program free for X days, and if you like it, pay for it to keep using it. I don't think that's unfair at all.

[Ancalagon]

I don't think bait and switch is a fair term for the beta program. It's more like a shareware model: try our software program free for X days, and if you like it, pay for it to keep using it. I don't think that's unfair at all.

bait and switch was a bit harsh, I'm not saying its unfair. I mean, it is a good way to test if you like it and if your hardware is compatible, fair enough.

But since I have no plans to pay for Windows 7, I dont see a point in using the beta, since it most likely means a reformat.

[Shadowstorm]

Damnit. Still doesn't boot.

I've tried three different DVD burners. What the fuck's the problem.

[Vector]

Meh, I dont like bait and switch. I'd need to pay for it if I wanted to continue using it once the beta expires. No thanks.

Bait and switch is when you lure someone in with one deal only to say its no longer available but then you offer them something else thats more expensive.

In this case you're getting a free loaner.

[Crittias]

But since I have no plans to pay for Windows 7, I dont see a point in using the beta, since it most likely means a reformat.That makes sense.

[Satertek]

Damnit. Still doesn't boot.

I've tried three different DVD burners. What the fuck's the problem.

Mount the ISO and run it straight from within your existing Windows install. That's been doable since Vista ya know ;)

[Shadowstorm]

Mount the ISO and run it straight from within your existing Windows install. That's been doable since Vista ya know ;)



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/Agentstorm/BLARGARBLEEERAAGEE.png
I want to be able to use this CD on multiple machines, some of which can't/won't get an Internet connection to download the beta directly from Microsoft.com. It's just more practical for me to install Win7 RC via this method.

[BlackPete]

Mount the ISO and run it straight from within your existing Windows install. That's been doable since Vista ya know ;)

It depends on what version your existing Windows install is -- if it's the beta Win7, then that's definitely a no-no (according to Microsoft).

[Crittias]

I want to be able to use this CD on multiple machines, some of which can't/won't get an Internet connection to download the beta directly from Microsoft.com. It's just more practical for me to install Win7 RC via this method.

Do you have access to another computer with a DVD burner? Perhaps a computer at work, or a friend's computer? I'd try different hardware.

Also, you may want to checksum your ISO of W7:
http://www.nullriver.com/products/winmd5sum

MD5 of Win7 32bit: 8867C133 - 30F56A93 - 944BCD46 - DCD73590

[H.Bogard]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/Agentstorm/BLARGARBLEEERAAGEE.png
I want to be able to use this CD on multiple machines, some of which can't/won't get an Internet connection to download the beta directly from Microsoft.com. It's just more practical for me to install Win7 RC via this method.



Got a similar error on XP32, you have to boot this. Might be dumb of me to ask, but are you sure you're not burning the ISO onto the DVD, and not the contents? :p

[Shadowstorm]

Do you have access to another computer with a DVD burner? Perhaps a computer at work, or a friend's computer? I'd try different hardware.

Also, you may want to checksum your ISO of W7:
http://www.nullriver.com/products/winmd5sum

MD5 of Win7 32bit: 8867C133 - 30F56A93 - 944BCD46 - DCD73590

It checks out.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/Agentstorm/checksum.png

Got a similar error on XP32, you have to boot this. Might be dumb of me to ask, but are you sure you're not burning the ISO onto the DVD, and not the contents? :p

I am burning the ISO. I open up Nero, hit "Burn Image", load "7100.0.090421-1700_x64fre_client_en-us_Retail_Ultimate-GRC1CULXFRER_EN_DVD.iso" from the file browser, and burn at the slowest setting.

[cp#]

Don't you know how to make your computer boot from a DVD?

[J Arcane]

burn at the slowest setting

Why would you do that?

[Shadowstorm]

No, I guess not :confused:.

[Shadowstorm]

Why would you do that?

Why wouldn't you do that? Burning slower is always better.

[J Arcane]

Why wouldn't you do that? Burning slower is always better.
I've never burned a disc on anything but the "auto" setting in every program, drive, and blank disc I have ever used, and have yet to have a problem.

Besides which, what exactly then is the point of even having a drive rated at anything but 1x if you're not going to use it?

[total]

I've never burned a disc on anything but the "auto" setting in every program, drive, and blank disc I have ever used, and have yet to have a problem.

Besides which, what exactly then is the point of even having a drive rated at anything but 1x if you're not going to use it?

You have very good luck. Depending on the media, burner, computer you can have varying results with different settings. Ritek DVDs (Taiyo Yuden rebrands...TYG02 I believe) for example will give you a much lower error rate (hence a better burn) when burned at 4x instead of anything else. It is truly odd, but none the less it is for realzies.

[Slack3r78]

You have very good luck. Depending on the media, burner, computer you can have varying results with different settings. Ritek DVDs (Taiyo Yuden rebrands...TYG02 I believe) for example will give you a much lower error rate (hence a better burn) when burned at 4x instead of anything else. It is truly odd, but none the less it is for realzies.
True 5-10 years ago, I don't think it really matters anymore. Can't remember the last time I've burned at a disc at anything less than the the maximum rated speed.

[Seika]

True 5-10 years ago, I don't think it really matters anymore. Can't remember the last time I've burned at a disc at anything less than the the maximum rated speed.

Ughh, I burned 3 copies of Windows 7, and only one worked perfectly.

I need to throw this crappy media out, and buy something good.

Anyone have recommended brands?


On Windows 7.
I don't play any games with punkbuster, so I'm completely happy with it. It really is as good as everyone says. :)

[J Arcane]

I think all my CDs and DVDs both havve been cheap TDKs, never had an issue with them. I think I might have some Memorex DVDs as well, but again, no problems.

[total]

True 5-10 years ago, I don't think it really matters anymore. Can't remember the last time I've burned at a disc at anything less than the the maximum rated speed.

It's still very true. Pick up a Princo DVD and burn it at 12x (or whatever your burner tops out at) then pick up a Taiyo Yuden or a Ricoh and do the same and look at the results in Nero. Granted a lot of the media that will give you absolutely horrid results at top speeds will still give you absolutely horrid results at any speed. Some of the media will give you a better burn at a lower speed, Ritek (they use different vendors for their media) is the first to pop to mind.

[Wraith]

Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor Beta (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=1b544e90-7659-4bd9-9e51-2497c146af15)

[Vector]

I burn discs daily at maximum speed and I can't recall the last time I made a coaster. I definitely agree that it's a thing of the past.

[total]

I burn discs daily at maximum speed and I can't recall the last time I made a coaster. I definitely agree that it's a thing of the past.

You guys are right. No one makes cheap shitty discs anymore. They are all exactly the same. That is why they are all exactly the same price.

[J Arcane]

You guys are right. No one makes cheap shitty discs anymore. They are all exactly the same. That is why they are all exactly the same price.
Then apparently I just don't buy cheap shitty discs I guess.

Funny how that works out.

[Vector]

You guys are right. No one makes cheap shitty discs anymore. They are all exactly the same. That is why they are all exactly the same price.

I assumed we were talking about products of reasonable quality. Obviously if you buy "shitty discs" they aren't going to work. My question for you is why are you buying "shitty discs"??

[Slack3r78]

You guys are right. No one makes cheap shitty discs anymore. They are all exactly the same. That is why they are all exactly the same price.
I buy the cheapest media available and it's not unusual for me to go through a few spindles of CD-Rs in a month's time at work. I never use anything less than the highest speed the burner and media combo will allow. As Vector stated, I can't recall the last time I burned a bad disc that wasn't the result of a failing drive, in which case the burning speed really doesn't matter.

I mean, I guess it's worth trying if you've run out of other things to try, but it's been literally years since I've had it make a bit of difference. Like I said, back in the day it was definitely a concern. I really don't think it matters in the vast majority of cases anymore.

[J Arcane]

Well, I made the switch.

I found myself using Windows 7 for pretty much everything except LOTRO, which I only had to boot to XP for because I didn't have room to install it on my existing Win7 partition.

I finally have an OS with all the neat features I liked in other OSes, but with the ability to actually game. It's like the two worlds have finally merged, and while it's definitely still got some kinks to work out, and there's some arguable performance differential between it and XP, I just couldn't bring myself to keep using XP when this was in front of me.

I will probably, and for the first time ever, actually pay for a Windows OS when this comes out officially. It's the first one I felt deserved the money.

EDIT: Also, I got Fallout 1 working in Windows 7. You just have to turn on all of the compatibility options and set it to Win95 mode.

[Seika]

Yes, games are so smooth on windows 7, I feel like I'm still in XP.

For UT3 and TF2, the framerate actually improved! :)

[Lithium Flower]

I'm thinking of making the switch to Windows 7 from Windows XP. Are drivers for common hardware (a few generic controllers, dlink wireless modem, a4tech M/KB and my ATI 4850) easily available? What about compatible software. Will 2 GB RAM be sufficient or should I get another 2 GB stick?

[Slack3r78]

I'm thinking of making the switch to Windows 7 from Windows XP. Are drivers for common hardware (a few generic controllers, dlink wireless modem, a4tech M/KB and my ATI 4850) easily available?
Yes.

What about compatible software.
If it ran under Vista, it will work with W7.

Will 2 GB RAM be sufficient or should I get another 2 GB stick?
It'll work fine, but when a 2GB stick is $20, the extra RAM will never hurt.

[Serapth]

I just gave up on my latest Linux experience... god that was painful. Sorry, verdict is Linux (KUbuntu with KDE 4.2 in this case) just isn't ready for prime time.

Going from Linux to Windows 7 RC made me realize just how incredibly far ahead Windows actually is from Linux. No complaints at all so far, everything just works. Closest thing to a pain in the ass i've encountered was I had to manually install the Tosihiba bluetooth stack, but I have a feeling this is a licensing issue, not a technical one. Oh yeah, and if you want to run Chrome, you need to download the beta version of 2, as Chrome 1 is heavily bugged.

So far I am delighted. It runs smoothly, hiccup free and has some really nice UI tweaks, nothing revolutionary, but some huge productivity wins. (Especially, the most recent activity submenus in the start bar, which is wickedly usefull for me with Remote Desktop to various machines. )

[H.Bogard]

I'm thinking of making the switch to Windows 7 from Windows XP. Are drivers for common hardware (a few generic controllers, dlink wireless modem, a4tech M/KB and my ATI 4850) easily available? What about compatible software. Will 2 GB RAM be sufficient or should I get another 2 GB stick?

For any drivers you can't find, you can just download the Vista 64 versions instead. They're working like a charm for my NForce mobo.

[J Arcane]

I'm thinking of making the switch to Windows 7 from Windows XP. Are drivers for common hardware (a few generic controllers, dlink wireless modem, a4tech M/KB and my ATI 4850) easily available? What about compatible software. Will 2 GB RAM be sufficient or should I get another 2 GB stick?
On my rig, I don't have to install a single driver under Windows 7. Makes installation a breeze. The only one I do install is the video, and that's technically optional really.

2GB of RAM is all either of the computers I'm running it on have, and they seem to do just fine. More couldn't hurt though if you can afford it, especially if you're using the 64-bit version, which means no meaningful RAM cap.

[Crittias]

I installed W7 on my laptop with 1GB of RAM, and it ran wonderfully. No Aero support, but that's a chipset issue, not a RAM issue. Other than that, no issues whatsoever.

[Wraith]

Retail box renderings? Link (http://community.winsupersite.com/blogs/paul/archive/2009/05/11/windows-7-box-shots.aspx)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/wraithakamrak/cog/win7_pro.jpg

[Lithium Flower]

Thanks for all the help guys, should make my decision easier. I'm going to need to repartition my hard drive I think. The volume in which I install OS, is just 10 GB. Would that be sufficient for just the OS if I switch to Win 7, given that I install all third party applications and games on another volume?

[J Arcane]

Thanks for all the help guys, should make my decision easier. I'm going to need to repartition my hard drive I think. The volume in which I install OS, is just 10 GB. Would that be sufficient for just the OS if I switch to Win 7, given that I install all third party applications and games on another volume?
My Windows folder alone is over 10 gigs. All told I think my fresh Win7 install is at least 13GB.

I would go with a 20GB partition, at minimum.

The one nice thing though, is that Windows doesn't tend to act up when the system drive gets full, like older Windows OSes tended to.

[torrefaction]

Wait, are people really still setting their burn speeds lower?

lol.

[torrefaction]

If it ran under Vista, it will work with W7.


Mostly accurate, but not universally true. Especially in regards to XP programs that lucked out and ran under Vista. But that's what the virtual machine is for.

[Serapth]

Wait, are people really still setting their burn speeds lower?

lol.

In some rare cases, it can still matter.

First off, a totally shitty ( or... SONY :( ) burner can require throttling, because it is a piece of shit. Again, see SONY!.

Second, when burning "exact" images, basically meaning images you shouldn't be burning, burning at a lower speed really does seem to matter. For example, I built a Mac OSX 10.5 disc three times, but until I burnt it at 6X instead of at max, it wouldnt work, regardless to what I did.


Most, I just want to say Sony DVD players are shit.

[Karak]

In some rare cases, it can still matter.

First off, a totally shitty ( or... SONY :( ) burner can require throttling, because it is a piece of shit. Again, see SONY!.

Second, when burning "exact" images, basically meaning images you shouldn't be burning, burning at a lower speed really does seem to matter. For example, I built a Mac OSX 10.5 disc three times, but until I burnt it at 6X instead of at max, it wouldnt work, regardless to what I did.


Most, I just want to say Sony DVD players are shit.

100% right. There were a couple articles last month about a test on this. They used Lite-On, Sony and one other and burned 10 different disks. All across the board setting it lower helped when burning "exact" images.

[Wraith]

Pirated Windows 7 Builds Botnet with Trojan (http://www.hardocp.com/news.html?news=Mzk1NTIsLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdCwsLDE=) (Hard|OCP)Got yourself a copy of Windows 7 using BitTorrent instead of the official release candidate? Well, it is likely you got some extra features (http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Security/Pirated-Windows-7-Builds-a-Botnet-With-Trojan-456054/) in your copy. Thanks to Mark Murphy for the link.Security researchers at Damballa report shutting down the command and control server of a botnet built by a Trojan bundled with pirated copies of Windows 7 RC. The Trojan is believed to have infected thousands of users.The eWeek article linked above isn't loading for me, but one might want to watch out if torrenting Win7 RC...

[J Arcane]

Besides hedge cases like Shadow's weird problems downloading the official image, I really don't understand why someone would even bother to go to the trouble of "pirating" something that is FREE.

[Seika]

Pirated Windows 7 Builds Botnet with Trojan (http://www.hardocp.com/news.html?news=Mzk1NTIsLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdCwsLDE=) (Hard|OCP)The eWeek article linked above isn't loading for me, but one might want to watch out if torrenting Win7 RC...

Well doh.

Most (if not all) of the programs on the PirateBay have all sorts of "special" features.
You get them at your own risk.

[Shadowstorm]

Besides hedge cases like Shadow's weird problems downloading the official image, I really don't understand why someone would even bother to go to the trouble of "pirating" something that is FREE.

A legit copy of Build 7100 was uploaded on a Bit Torrent site(s) about a week prior to the actual May 5th release date. In other words, I know it is free; I just wanted to get it early.

In any case, the MD5 hash values check out, so I'm good.

Still haven't figured out a way to put it on a bootable DVD, but whatever. It runs fine in VMware.

[Crittias]

My wife has been watching over my shoulder as I've played with W7, and she's impressed enough with it that she wants to bite the bullet and install it on her computer in our home office.

I think that means I have permission to buy another SSD to install in her PC as well. Cool! Spousal permission to spend money!

[Lithium Flower]

I got it off PirateBay too. MS's servers were being lazy so I decided to give them a break. It was uploaded May 8th. I did have mind to check the MD5 value within utorrent but it didn't check out with the value being brandished all over the internet, so I re-downloaded it from MS.
Then I downloaded FastSum and checked both files out and they ended up being identical.

The checksum value I obtained for both is:

98341AF35655137966E382C4FEAA282D

[Jackel]

I grabbed it from a newsgroup...simply because I wanted it faster.

[Serapth]

Now here is the question.... how many people are willing to replace their existing ( primary ) Windows XP or Vista install with Windows 7?

I am using it on my laptop, but my primary desktop is still Vista for now. The timebomb pretty much being the reason why.

[Wraith]

Yeah, I'm not ready to start using it as my main OS yet for just that reason. I don't want to have to re-reinstall everything once the retail release hits. I'll keep kicking along with XP for now, using 7 as a secondary.

[Troggles]

I'm using 7 as my main OS for now. Of course, I have everything I need backed up on my external so I can bounce between OS's if needed.

[Lithium Flower]

I'm going to go the Main OS route. Generally I always end up format-installing at least once a year anyway, so let's see.

Collecting drivers and all today.

[Crittias]

I have it installed on my primary machine. I have all my data on a second HD, so reinstalling the OS in a few months is no big deal.

[Shadowstorm]

Has anyone else seen this?

h7WzCI_yxBw

[biosc1]

Has anyone else seen this?


Hmfff...that's not my user experience yet...some interesting things in there, though.

[Slack3r78]

That looks like a usability nightmare.

[Wilkz07]

I've had it running since last saturday and its great. I like how there is no sidebar and the preview popup of stacked apps is great.

my only gripe is that for some reason whenever my pc is restarted I lose my internet connection and have to diable/re-enable my network card. Its easier to do now that I know where the reset is (took awhile to get internet the day I installed the OS). So I just don't turn my pc off now. Will be happy when all my stuff and drivers work.

[Voodoo]

Has anyone else seen this?

I think it looks cool. I believe, though, to actually make it useful that you'd have to be sure your files are tagged appropriately. I've been doing this with my huge collection of music, movies and images; it is a fairly convoluted task even though it is a lot easier in Vista than it was in XP. I'm not familiar with how multiple items are tagged in OS X though.

I did like the taskbar and start menu as well as the context menus that would pop up from the variable size taskbar.

[Goronmon]

my only gripe is that for some reason whenever my pc is restarted I lose my internet connection and have to diable/re-enable my network card. Its easier to do now that I know where the reset is (took awhile to get internet the day I installed the OS). So I just don't turn my pc off now. Will be happy when all my stuff and drivers work.Yeah, I've had that issue before when running the beta, but haven't seen it in a while. Wonder what is causing it.

[Deadend]

That concept seems ok.. but I have a bad feeling about any product using that Ok Go song.

[Lithium Flower]

Am now posting from a Win 7 install! Most things seem hunky dory, except my firewall doesn't work. It's the vista 64 version.

On the hardware side. I have two issues. Firstly my network can't connect to the internet over the router except in Bridge mode. It worked in the PPPOE/PPPOA mode once last night, but when I restarted it - no dice. I had glanced at the posts addressing this problem above and tried enabling and disabling my network adapter - it worked once, but not the second time.

Secondly, while I was installing, I got this screen I hadn't ever gotten before. It said something like "Select CDROM Boot type 1 or 2". I entered 1 each time it asked me (and it was every time it had to restart during installation) and everything went smoothly but when I removed the install disc and restarted I got a blinking cursor.

Anyway know where I can search for solutions to these issues?

[Xerxes]

Looks so spiffy, but I feel I should just wait. Playing around with OSs unless I have to seem like a chore. I did sign up for that Office 2010 beta.


Mmmmm OneNote 2010...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2357/2141808218_7bb9d4ed06.jpg

[Serapth]

I will say, I am completely impressed by Windows 7, but Windows Live Mail is a cyst on a boil on the taint of the software industry.

God this program sucks ass in a way I imagine ass has never been sucked. I tried, but screw this, I am installing Outlook or Thunderbird. You would think little things like... unread messages or deleting emails wouldn't be such a chore. Not to mention, it often just stops working, meaning I am not getting mail for no apparent reason. Ugh.

[Xerxes]

I will say, I am completely impressed by Windows 7, but Windows Live Mail is a cyst on a boil on the taint of the software industry.

God this program sucks ass in a way I imagine ass has never been sucked. I tried, but screw this, I am installing Outlook or Thunderbird. You would think little things like... unread messages or deleting emails wouldn't be such a chore. Not to mention, it often just stops working, meaning I am not getting mail for no apparent reason. Ugh.

I've always found Windows Mail to be shit.

[AntonThaGreat]

Installed it earlier today. Seems pretty much the same as Vista to me except the taskbar.
Witcher did seem to run a little better though.

[Wraith]

Exclusive: Microsoft to remove 3 app limit from Windows 7 Starter (http://community.winsupersite.com/blogs/paul/archive/2009/05/22/exclusive-microsoft-to-remove-3-app-limit-from-windows-7-starter.aspx)No word yet on whether the other lame limitation--the bizarre inability to change the desktop wallpaper--will be fixed as well. To be honest, this is a bigger issue than the 3 app limit, which sounds horrible but doesn't actually come up all that often if at all.So...I guess Starter will be a more feasible option for some netbooks and very low end systems now, rather than being relegated to emerging markets. (Remember, this edition of Win7 will probably only be available through OEMs.)

Win7 Editions - feature comparison (http://www.winsupersite.com/win7/win7_skus_compare.asp)

[Stoke]

Ok, so I've run into my fist real issue with 7. I can't fucking share files. If I come from the Vista computer I navigate the files but as soon as I get to the folder I shared on the 7 computer it says I'm denied access. If I come from the 7 computer as soon as I click the Vista computer's icon in the network window it asks for a user/password. I've turned off password protection, homegroups, and any other retarded fucking safety net MS has and I still can't do it. How hard is it to just let me share the fucking file with every person who connects to the computer?

[muddi900]

http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-7/share-files-and-printers-between-windows-7-and-xp/

[biosc1]

Ok, so I've run into my fist real issue with 7. I can't fucking share files. If I come from the Vista computer I navigate the files but as soon as I get to the folder I shared on the 7 computer it says I'm denied access. If I come from the 7 computer as soon as I click the Vista computer's icon in the network window it asks for a user/password. I've turned off password protection, homegroups, and any other retarded fucking safety net MS has and I still can't do it. How hard is it to just let me share the fucking file with every person who connects to the computer?

I had this issue when setting up my HTPC. I ended up making an HTPCUser on the machine I wanted to access the files and giving it a password. I then made sure that the 2 computers were in the same workgroup. Then, I have my HTPC actually log onto the Vista machine by mounted the folder with a username and password. Works fine, may not be the simplest workaround, but it works.

[Vector]

That looks like a usability nightmare.

Looked pretty straight forward if you ask me....can you elaborate?

[Serapth]

Ok, so I've run into my fist real issue with 7. I can't fucking share files. If I come from the Vista computer I navigate the files but as soon as I get to the folder I shared on the 7 computer it says I'm denied access. If I come from the 7 computer as soon as I click the Vista computer's icon in the network window it asks for a user/password. I've turned off password protection, homegroups, and any other retarded fucking safety net MS has and I still can't do it. How hard is it to just let me share the fucking file with every person who connects to the computer?

Start->Type 'shar'->Choose Network and Sharing->Choose Homegroup and Sharing options->Change advanced settings...->Turn on File and Printer Sharing.

[muddi900]

Finally installed the RC on my dad's netbook. Had my first BSOD in years. Probably because of the xp drivers for the touch pad I installed. Works almost as good as the beta does on my gaming box. THIS IS WINDOWS GODDAMNIT! new installs should feel like shitting tacks.

EDIT: Fuck man, "flip" works surprisingly well too

[Stoke]

http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-7/share-files-and-printers-between-windows-7-and-xp/

Start->Type 'shar'->Choose Network and Sharing->Choose Homegroup and Sharing options->Change advanced settings...->Turn on File and Printer Sharing.

Had done both of those before posting and it was still doing it. It finally started working though, I just left both of the computers for a while to make lunch and when I came back I could transfer them over just fine. It either took a good half hour for the changes to take effect or there are some elves in my house running around fixing problems. Either way it works and I'm happy. :)

[Slack3r78]

Looked pretty straight forward if you ask me....can you elaborate?
It's a labyrinth of nested menus and obscured information. Makes for a flashy video, but that's about it.

[J Arcane]

It's a labyrinth of nested menus and obscured information. Makes for a flashy video, but that's about it.
If there's anything I've learned about both Windows and KDE, it's that some designers seem to think "Why make this one click, when we could make it 12?"

[Vector]

It's a labyrinth of nested menus and obscured information. Makes for a flashy video, but that's about it.

I guess...looked pretty intuitive to me.

[muddi900]

That looks like a usability nightmare.

Actually for the average joe, it is perfect.

Also everybody keeps talking about scalability of Windows 7, but I am still shocked how the user experience is the same b/w my netbook and my gaming box. Woh!

[Slack3r78]

Actually for the average joe, it is perfect.

Also everybody keeps talking about scalability of Windows 7, but I am still shocked how the user experience is the same b/w my netbook and my gaming box. Woh!
What they arrived at is great; what was in that video was terrible.

[Vector]

what was in that video was terrible.

Can you be more specific? Otherwise it sounds like you're just hating on it to hate on it.

[Slack3r78]

Can you be more specific? Otherwise it sounds like you're just hating on it to hate on it.
I was.

It's a labyrinth of nested menus and obscured information.

Information being obscured and magically appearing is all well and fine if you want a flashy demo, but it's generally bad interface design. There's no obvious way of divining that interface elements are going to react as they do in that video. Icons folding out into menus and the like don't really have much basis in any other paradigm a user's likely to be familiar with.

What they ended up with in W7 is great, but I'm glad that most of what's in that video never really made it out of the mockup stage.

EDIT:

There are also some flat out brain dead implementations in that video -- the stack element they show off at around 0:25 is just plain bad design.

EDIT 2:

The biggest problem all around is that the UI they're showing off is trying to put too much information at the forefront and sacrifices information that might actually be important. The end result is cluttered and busy at best. The dock-type element around 1:20 is a good example of this. The bizarre combination of obscuring things down to application icons with also expanding them out to a shortened version of what the icon actually represents when hovered over is just a complete mess.

[Vector]

That's your opinion of course. I don't agree with any of it but to each their own. Seemed very intuitive to me but maybe I'm just better at picking up new things.

[Serapth]

It's hard to agree with anything in your post...I guess that's the beauty of opinions though. Most of your observations are purely subjective yet you try and pass them off as fact.

The interface seemed very straight forwar and intuitve. Not sure why it was so confusing to you.

To some degree, UI is an artform. On the otherhand, it is also a valid science and UIs can have very poor usability.


Thats not to say poor idea's can't get accepted by the general public. For example, the fact that in order to shutdown a windows PC you have to click "START" is pretty much a boneheaded design decision. And yet... its how things are done. Doesn't make it right though.

[Vector]

To some degree, UI is an artform. On the otherhand, it is also a valid science and UIs can have very poor usability.

Oh I agree completely. I just don't feel like any of his points were beyond his own subjective reaction.

[Slack3r78]

To some degree, UI is an artform. On the otherhand, it is also a valid science and UIs can have very poor usability.
Which is why I'm a huge fan of usability studies and having set interface guidelines for a platform. There's always an element of subjectivity involved, sure, but that's not to say that poorly designed elements can't stick out like a sore thumb, either.

Thats not to say poor idea's can't get accepted by the general public. For example, the fact that in order to shutdown a windows PC you have to click "START" is pretty much a boneheaded design decision. And yet... its how things are done. Doesn't make it right though.
And the fact that Microsoft has started taking usability testing much more seriously is why 'Start' has been replaced with the Windows logo in Vista and up. I'd lay money it's also why a lot of the concepts in that video were ditched, too.

Another good example of the Start menu being broken in a subtle manner is the fact that up until Windows 2000 it didn't obey Fitts' law. There was actually a slight border on the left and bottom corners of the Start button meaning users had to precisely click the start button rather than being able to just sling the mouse to one corner. Silly mistake, but it took MS years to fix it.

Oh I agree completely. I just don't feel like any of his points were beyond his own subjective reaction.
I gave you two very specific examples of major problems with that interface. But I'll elaborate even further since you want to dismiss those criticisms out of hand.

Clicking on a stack unfolded to a series of icons, fine. But the revealed icons were presented with truncated names and two of them were even using almost identical names demonstrating exactly what was wrong with the design -- information is being obscured, but when a user clicks to reveal the hidden information, they are presented with another interface with no easy way to distinguish between items. By trying to present too much to the user, they end up presenting nowhere near enough. The dock-like application I pointed out has exactly the same problem.

Now, if you'd like to point out exactly what about that is good design, I'll be glad to listen, but I can't come up with any justification for it, and apparently Microsoft couldn't either given that both features were scrapped by time even the earliest betas of W7 rolled around.

[Matthias]

What they ended up with in W7 is great, but I'm glad that most of what's in that video never really made it out of the mockup stage.

Actually, that's an internal tech demo for Project Copenhagen, which is the codename for Windows "8," which has already begun light development. It's basically a hodge-podge of ideas thrown together in a brainstorming session. Some of it makes sense, some of it doesn't, and a LOT of it seems like it'd be great for a stylus but would suck for a mouse. Anything involving dragging- like that login shot at the beginning- seems tailored for Tablet PCs.

I like the idea of the stacks (they're basically just spring-loaded folders for opening and closing), but I agree that limiting the info on each internal file is a bad idea. Like I said though, this looks like a brainstorming session, and was probably thrown together by a pretty young team member based on the intro and music.

[Serapth]

New favorite feature just discovered by accident.

WINKEY + UP Arrow == maximize
WINKEY + DOWN == restore, down again = minimize
W+R arrow = Tile to the right

Sweet.

[Crittias]

I just installed W7 on my wife's computer. So far, so good. I'm sure the new SSD drive isn't hurting her early impressions at all: things are running buttery smooth, and QUIET!

[Wraith]

Windows 7 Hard Drive and SSD Performance Analyzed (http://hothardware.com/Articles/Windows-7-Disk-Performance-Analyzed/?page=1) (HotHardware)

[Vector]

I gave you two very specific examples of major problems with that interface. But I'll elaborate even further since you want to dismiss those criticisms out of hand..

You gave two opinions...nothing more. You act like you provided a formal proof.

[Crittias]

Windows 7 Hard Drive and SSD Performance Analyzed (http://hothardware.com/Articles/Windows-7-Disk-Performance-Analyzed/?page=1) (HotHardware)Makes me even happier that I went the SSD route. Money well spent (kinda).

I've only had one major issue with 7 on my wife's computer: she uses a variety of statistical programs, and one of them, SDC Platinum, does NOT play well with the OS. It causes a procedural error in Shell32.dll, something that then begins to affect other installed programs (Live Sync, Acrobat, etc.) I had to restore to before the install to get the system running correctly again.

I also have a minor issue where Acrobat 8.0 presents an error message when opening PDF files inside the browser. The error claims it won't work, which is funny, because as soon as you click OK...it works just fine. Odd.

[Voodoo]

It's a labyrinth of nested menus and obscured information. Makes for a flashy video, but that's about it.

Quite close you are. As a matter of fact, that video is 100% fake (http://www.istartedsomething.com/20090417/windows-enthusiast-cullen-cophenhagen-ux-concept-video/), took 2 months to make and made mostly with Flash. So, you are quite right that it made for a flashy video and that was about it.

...and here is Cullen's blog. (http://cmdudas.blogspot.com/)

[Slack3r78]

You gave two opinions...nothing more. You act like you provided a formal proof.
Opinions backed up by substantive reasoning.

Have you ever read a HIG? A usability study? Hell, a basic primer on UI design concepts?

I'm not complaining about touchy feely subjective crap like the color of dialogue boxes; I'm pointing out things that will cause users to fail to complete a task during usability testing. And before you jump down my throat about that statement, a significant portion of users will fail to complete almost any task you give them during usability testing. The key is to get that number down as low as possible, and the demo makes a number of basic errors that are complete usability traps for some users.

UI design and usability isn't about how omgsmart you personally are, it's about the clarity of the interface. Color me unsurprised that the whole thing is a flash mockup designed by an 18 year old. It's nice to see a kid with a bit of passion, but it's clear glancing at his blog that he thinks interface design is about making things look cool and that he doesn't have any kind of background in interface design theory.

But clearly I'm unjustified in leveling any criticism at that design and am only interested in hating just to hate. Widely accepted UI theory is just my opinion and this kid has obviously come up with a flawless design.

[torrefaction]

I'm so amused. Slack3r is the biggest UI geek I know, and one of the people I talk to tech most in the world in general. You're in for a very rude surprise if you continue to claim he's being subjective. Wait until he starts throwing specific sections of HIG's at you.

Trust me, it's annoying, because we disagree on certain UI things...and he wins sometimes.

I hate when people win.

[Serapth]

I worked with a usability expert once.... what a giant douchebag he was.

This isnt a shot at slacker, but lets just say having a job title doesn't make you any better at usability.

Then again, most solid usability is thrown out on the web 2.0 ( blarg! ), and FLASH! ( not the bloatware, although its a good example ) seems to win over substance 9 times out of 10. Even google, the former champion of simple streamlined user interfaces have lost the plot recently... don't get me started on WAVE!


Oh and off topic rant, ADOBE should die in a fire. They haven't released a solidly good product in years, either just milking the company cow ( Photoshop ), bloating Flash and Acrobat up more and more. Ugh, Abobe you suck.

The fact PDF reader is like a 30 meg download is fucking sick. Thank god for foxit software! Now if only we could convince the world to switch from Flash to either Silverlight ( smaller, faster, better and doesnt bring a quad core machine to its knees rendering grainy video! ) or better yet, straight HTML.

[Vector]

I'm so amused. Slack3r is the biggest UI geek I know, and one of the people I talk to tech most in the world in general. You're in for a very rude surprise if you continue to claim he's being subjective. Wait until he starts throwing specific sections of HIG's at you.

Trust me, it's annoying, because we disagree on certain UI things...and he wins sometimes.

I hate when people win.

Noone wins when it comes to opinions. He hasn't proven anything in this thread other than the fact that he didn't like the UI. Simply stating "I read HIG's" doesn't make his opinion any more fact that some film buff saying "I went to film school". There's no such thing as an invalid opinion.

There are popular and unpopular opinions but never wrong ones. Let's put it this way. I'd be willing to bet top dollar that most people would prefer an editor with a mouse but that doesn't negate the opinion of the small few who love using EMACS from the Unix shell. You can cite HIG's and polls all you want but that doesn't make someone wrong for liking it.

[J Arcane]

There are popular and unpopular opinions but never wrong ones.

Hah hah hah hah hah hah hah!

No.

[Vector]

Hah hah hah hah hah hah hah!

No.

Well that's just your opinion :p

An opinion is a belief that may or may not be backed up with evidence, but which cannot be proved with that evidence. It is normally a subjective statement and may be the result of an emotion or an interpretation of facts; people may draw opposing opinions from the same facts

I'm talking about opinions based on people's reactions to something...for example "I liked that movie"

Are you saying they can be wrong? That they actually did not like the movie? Can you cite an example where someone is wrong in describing their opinion towards something?

[J Arcane]

The idea that there are "no wrong opinions" is one of the most insidious and destructive pieces of bullshit ever introduced to modern society.

I'm sorry, but no. Just because I state some piece of bullshit as "my opinion" doesn't some how obviate any accountability. If my "opinion" is that the moon really is made of cheese, I am most certainly fucking wrong, and stating "but it's my opinion!" is a non-answer at best, and a disingenuous and fallacious appeal to a bullshit philosophy at worst.

[Serapth]

Well a classic example of wrong but write is our keyboard layout. We still to this day, use a keyboard layout designed to slow us down as to reduce damage to typewriters. This is an example of a BAD UI, in the it is sub-optimal, except it is expected and familiar which is a GOOD UI.


Oh, and for some reason I keep reading "Slacker reads HIGs" as "Slacker eats figs".

[Vector]

The idea that there are "no wrong opinions" is one of the most insidious and destructive pieces of bullshit ever introduced to modern society.

I'm sorry, but no. Just because I state some piece of bullshit as "my opinion" doesn't some how obviate any accountability. If my "opinion" is that the moon really is made of cheese, I am most certainly fucking wrong, and stating "but it's my opinion!" is a non-answer at best, and a disingenuous and fallacious appeal to a bullshit philosophy at worst.

You're not even talking about what I'm talking about. I'm talking about people's opinion in regards to what they like or dislike. You can't negate someone elses opinions because you feel differently.

You're talking about people pushing unsubstantiated claims about the world as fact.

This Slacker guy doesn't like the interface...he also seems to think that because he's into UI's his opinion carries more weight. Unfortunately that doesn't mean squat to those who had no problem with the UI. I'm not gonna say "oh wait...you didn't like it? Well now I don't like it".

Maybe Slackers design would sell better than the one I like. That's fine...notepad is more popular and widely used than EMACS. That doesn't mean EMACS is bad and that the people who use it are wrong.

That's all I'm saying.

[torrefaction]

Well a classic example of wrong but write is our keyboard layout. We still to this day, use a keyboard layout designed to slow us down as to reduce damage to typewriters. This is an example of a BAD UI, in the it is sub-optimal, except it is expected and familiar which is a GOOD UI.


Oh, and for some reason I keep reading "Slacker reads HIGs" as "Slacker eats figs".

Studies have shown that the Dvorak studies were actually biased, and most likely untrue. At least, if this is what you're referring to (Which most people do.)

However, since you're intelligent, you're probably referring to deviating from the alphabet to QWERTY since typewriters didn't have the ability to keep up the speed with the typist without interlocking hammers ;)

[torrefaction]

Maybe Slackers design would sell better than the one I like. That's fine...notepad is more popular and widely used than EMACS. That doesn't mean EMACS is bad and that the people who use it are wrong.

That's all I'm saying.

No. Not sell better. Be more usable by the vast majority of people in scientific, double blind studies performed by study groups around the world by various research groups including Apple. Keep the argument straight.

[J Arcane]

Well a classic example of wrong but write is our keyboard layout. We still to this day, use a keyboard layout designed to slow us down as to reduce damage to typewriters. This is an example of a BAD UI, in the it is sub-optimal, except it is expected and familiar which is a GOOD UI.


Oh, and for some reason I keep reading "Slacker reads HIGs" as "Slacker eats figs".
That keyboard story is a myth. Plenty of contemporary typewriter designs got around the problem of arm clash, but the format remained standard anyhow, because it actually isn't any more inefficient that other options. In the 1950s the government even did their own usability studies, as there was great interest in possibily switching to Dvorak, but found that despite Dvorak's claims, the QWERTY layout was actually no less efficient, in some cases faster, than Dvorak's.

It is true that, in part, the layout was designed to reduce clash, but if that were the only reason it could've quickly been replaced when the technology was still in relative infancy, and even the design that initially encouraged QWERTY's development was eventually refined to reduce the issue.

[Serapth]

You're not even talking about what I'm talking about. I'm talking about people's opinion in regards to what they like or dislike. You can't negate someone elses opinions because you feel differently.

You're talking about people pushing unsubstantiated claims about the world as fact.

This Slacker guy doesn't like the interface...he also seems to think that because he's into UI's his opinion carries more weight. Unfortunately that doesn't mean squat to those who had no problem with the UI. I'm not gonna say "oh wait...you didn't like it? Well now I don't like it".

Maybe Slackers design would sell better than the one I like. That's fine...notepad is more popular and widely used than EMACS. That doesn't mean EMACS is bad and that the people who use it are wrong.

That's all I'm saying.

EMACS actually is pretty bad, not vi bad, but bad.

[J Arcane]

You're not even talking about what I'm talking about. I'm talking about people's opinion in regards to what they like or dislike. You can't negate someone elses opinions because you feel differently.

You're talking about people pushing unsubstantiated claims about the world as fact.

This Slacker guy doesn't like the interface...he also seems to think that because he's into UI's his opinion carries more weight. Unfortunately that doesn't mean squat to those who had no problem with the UI. I'm not gonna say "oh wait...you didn't like it? Well now I don't like it".

Maybe Slackers design would sell better than the one I like. That's fine...notepad is more popular and widely used than EMACS. That doesn't mean EMACS is bad and that the people who use it are wrong.

That's all I'm saying.
As torre and Slacker have been trying to point out to you, this is not a matter of personal opinion. This is actual, tested, researched, science we're talking about.

[Slack3r78]

Noone wins when it comes to opinions. He hasn't proven anything in this thread other than the fact that he didn't like the UI. Simply stating "I read HIG's" doesn't make his opinion any more fact that some film buff saying "I went to film school". There's no such thing as an invalid opinion.
Except that's not what I'm stating. You also fundamentally misunderstand what usability in this context means. I am saying that if you sat a group of users down in front of that UI, it makes a number of mistakes that will increase the number of users who will fail to complete a given task.

You know what it's called when you can quantitatively measure something? Objectivity.

Why are the things I'm criticizng not just things that I don't prefer, but rather real problems? Because they've been tried before. Because we already have usability studies showing them to objectively cause users problems.

There are popular and unpopular opinions but never wrong ones.
If UI design were purely art, you'd be correct, but it's not. It's a combination of art and science. The things I'm pointing out are problems on the science end of things; things we can and have objectively measured.

Let's put it this way. I'd be willing to bet top dollar that most people would prefer an editor with a mouse but that doesn't negate the opinion of the small few who love using EMACS from the Unix shell. You can cite HIG's and polls all you want but that doesn't make someone wrong for liking it.
You're still mistaking preference for general usability. They're not the same thing. You're free to like whatever you want, I really couldn't care less there. What I'm focusing on are the usability aspects of the interface. Your opinion doesn't matter if it can be objectively shown that a greater number of users have a hard time navigating a given interface. I've not once argued nor really cared about anything that can't be objectively measured here.

[Slack3r78]

You're not even talking about what I'm talking about. I'm talking about people's opinion in regards to what they like or dislike. You can't negate someone elses opinions because you feel differently.
Again, this is not about opinion. You're the one that thinks I'm talking about anything subjective here despite the fact that I'm not arguing about my personal preference.

This Slacker guy doesn't like the interface...he also seems to think that because he's into UI's his opinion carries more weight. Unfortunately that doesn't mean squat to those who had no problem with the UI. I'm not gonna say "oh wait...you didn't like it? Well now I don't like it".
I only like or dislike it so much in the sense that I'm a fan of usable interfaces. I'm basing my impression of the interface on design elements that have been shown to work poorly.

Maybe Slackers design would sell better than the one I like. That's fine...notepad is more popular and widely used than EMACS. That doesn't mean EMACS is bad and that the people who use it are wrong.

That's all I'm saying.

Quoting Torre for Truth here:
No. Not sell better. Be more usable by the vast majority of people in scientific, double blind studies performed by study groups around the world by various research groups including Apple. Keep the argument straight.

[torrefaction]

EMACS actually is pretty bad, not vi bad, but bad.

Fuck you VI is awesome.

[J Arcane]

Fuck you VI is awesome.
Fuck you, I use pico.

[torrefaction]

Fuck you, I use pico.

Why don't you just go ahead and use nano, pansie.

[J Arcane]

Why don't you just go ahead and use nano, pansie.
Which ever one I can get.

Wordstar based interfaces for life, dawg.

[torrefaction]

Which ever one I can get.

Wordstar based interfaces for life, dawg.

We may bicker a bit on subjects, but you're good people Arcane.

[Serapth]

Fuck you VI is awesome.

VI is half a step up from EDLIN.

[torrefaction]

VI is half a step up from EDLIN.

And your mom is a half step up from a venetian crack whore.

[Serapth]

And your mom is a half step up from a venetian crack whore.

Say what you will, you still owe her 3.50$.

[civil]

Sorry to interrupt the discussion about the going rates for Serapth's mom (Pro Tip: Pay her in American Dollars for extra lovin') but...

Has anyone done a fresh install of this on a blank drive? I'm getting a fancy new SSD in today and I think I'm going straight to Windows 7, but don't know (and with my limited understanding can't surmise) if it's advisable to do so.





Bueller?

[total]

Sorry to interrupt the discussion about the going rates for Serapth's mom (Pro Tip: Pay her in American Dollars for extra lovin') but...

Has anyone done a fresh install of this on a blank drive? I'm getting a fancy new SSD in today and I think I'm going straight to Windows 7, but don't know (and with my limited understanding can't surmise) if it's advisable to do so.





Bueller?

Done it about 5 times now. Just boot off the USB or DVD or whatever and go.

[civil]

Done it about 5 times now. Just boot off the USB or DVD or whatever and go.
Yeah, I realized that after I posted. :o

To prove what a man I am I won't modify my original post and leave myself open to mocking from the community.

[total]

You install things poorly with a lack of flair. I fart in your general direction.

[civil]

And I sniff in yours!

[Serapth]

Sorry to interrupt the discussion about the going rates for Serapth's mom (Pro Tip: Pay her in American Dollars for extra lovin') but...

Has anyone done a fresh install of this on a blank drive? I'm getting a fancy new SSD in today and I think I'm going straight to Windows 7, but don't know (and with my limited understanding can't surmise) if it's advisable to do so.





Bueller?

Yes, because of you, she wont accept Pesos anymore!

[total]

And I sniff in yours!

I had pizza last night and am lactose intolerant. I fear for your nose.

[civil]

Yes, because of you, she wont accept Pesos anymore!
Dude...no one takes pesos anymore. At this point I think you can buy a house with a firm handshake and a quick crotch grab in Mexico. :(

[civil]

I did it! I installed my new SSD and threw Windows 7 on there.

So far, this is faster than my mom on Prom Night.

[Serapth]

I did it! I installed my new SSD and threw Windows 7 on there.

So far, this is faster than my mom on Prom Night.

Yes, but has it given you herpes yet? You know... like your mom ( on Mondays, let alone Prom night! )

[civil]

Oh come on, Canadian. I took one for the team by setting me own muddah up. At least give me the courtesy of responding in kind.

[Serapth]

Oh come on, Canadian. I took one for the team by setting me own muddah up. At least give me the courtesy of responding in kind.

I've set my mother up hundreds of times, but you cheap bastards never pay!

[iHap]

Anyone else using an nvidia card with Windows 7 and that stupid stereoscopic 3D keeps turning itself on? It's frustrating to have to turn the bloody thing off unless i want my games to look 3D when i don't want it, or have the glasses for it.

[Lithium Flower]

3D, what 3D? Do you mean Aero glass? Why would you want to turn it off? =/

I've been going exclusive with Windows 7 for about a month now and it's been pretty trouble-free so far.

One thing I'm beginning to notice just now however is that if I leave my computer running for long periods of time (which is frequently the case), I sometimes find on my return(when it comes out of display turned off mode) that right-click menus don't come up on the desktop or for any of the taskbar or desktop icons. They wink in and out, like something's blocking them from appearing, weird glitchy behavior.

It disappears either after a restart (a cold one, since I can't get the menu button to pop-up the menu either) or if I use the windows key or the context menu shortcut on my keyboard.

Anyone have this issue?

Any idea what could be causing it?

[total]

3D, what 3D? Do you mean Aero glass? Why would you want to turn it off? =/

I've been going exclusive with Windows 7 for about a month now and it's been pretty trouble-free so far.

One thing I'm beginning to notice just now however is that if I leave my computer running for long periods of time (which is frequently the case), I sometimes find on my return(when it comes out of display turned off mode) that right-click menus don't come up on the desktop or for any of the taskbar or desktop icons. They wink in and out, like something's blocking them from appearing, weird glitchy behavior.

It disappears either after a restart (a cold one, since I can't get the menu button to pop-up the menu either) or if I use the windows key or the context menu shortcut on my keyboard.

Anyone have this issue?

Any idea what could be causing it?

I had some funky issues like that while using the default video drivers for my Ati 4850. I would reinstall your video drivers as a starting point.

[Serapth]

I have had some oddities with Windows 7. Mapping a webdav server as a network drive then copy a file to it, it does 95% of the copy and hangs, forever. This is annoying trasnfering files to my phone.

[Shadowstorm]

Perhaps you should try TeraCopy (http://www.codesector.com/teracopy.php)?

[Serapth]

Perhaps you should try TeraCopy (http://www.codesector.com/teracopy.php)?

I just remote desktop to one of 6 other computers in my house and do the copy that way.


... I really need to stop with the computers.

[Lithium Flower]

@Total: I do happen to have an ATI 4850 myself. But I downloaded and installed the latest drivers. I could try reinstalling. Thanks for the heads up. Will post if the issue crops up again after driver reinstall.

[total]

I just remote desktop to one of 6 other computers in my house and do the copy that way.


... I really need to stop with the computers.

But you won't...because I'm sure you are like me and you need a computer is almost every damn room...and sometimes you just don't feel like using the fucking laptop.

@Total: I do happen to have an ATI 4850 myself. But I downloaded and installed the latest drivers. I could try reinstalling. Thanks for the heads up. Will post if the issue crops up again after driver reinstall.

Yeah once I installed the catalyst...9.4 drivers I had no issues. I also found the earlier drivers were not controlling the fan properly which was fixed in the 9.4 ones.

[Serapth]

But you won't...because I'm sure you are like me and you need a computer is almost every damn room...and sometimes you just don't feel like using the fucking laptop.


Actually, if I build a house, its going to be wired with fibre at the least. Then I am going to put an extremely powerful computer in the basement and dumb touch terminals in each room. I want a touch screen beside my toilet through which I can place calls, surf the net or stream video.

The tech is all there, just a matter of splicing it all together.

[Matthias]

I want a touch screen beside my toilet through which I can place calls.

Hopefully not video calls :eek:

[Serapth]

Hopefully not video calls :eek:

Then why the hell would I want a video toilet in my bathroom?!?!?!?

[iHap]

3D, what 3D? Do you mean Aero glass? Why would you want to turn it off? =/

I've been going exclusive with Windows 7 for about a month now and it's been pretty trouble-free so far.

One thing I'm beginning to notice just now however is that if I leave my computer running for long periods of time (which is frequently the case), I sometimes find on my return(when it comes out of display turned off mode) that right-click menus don't come up on the desktop or for any of the taskbar or desktop icons. They wink in and out, like something's blocking them from appearing, weird glitchy behavior.

It disappears either after a restart (a cold one, since I can't get the menu button to pop-up the menu either) or if I use the windows key or the context menu shortcut on my keyboard.

Anyone have this issue?

Any idea what could be causing it?

I'm talking about this.

http://i41.tinypic.com/atvz9k.png

[H.Bogard]

I gotta note down a reminder to buy me some of them 3D glasses from NV.

But I won't be sticking to NVidia cards for long, though. :\

[Satertek]

Upgrade attempt from Build 7000 (Beta) to 7100 (RC) was a failure. After waiting 5 hours on it, I restarted and found in the log files it was looping this every 5 seconds:

2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e4] MIG Successfully mapped HKCU
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e2] MIG Adding indirect mapping from HKCU\Software\Classes to <C:\Users\Brian\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\Usr Class.dat> loaded at HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000_Classes (R/W)
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e4] MIG Successfully mapped HKCU\Software\Classes
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x08040f] MIG Setting SMI registry mappings for user context (HKU\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000, HKU\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000_Classes)
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e6] MIG Removing mapping for HKCU\Software\Classes
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e7] MIG Successfully unmapped HKCU\Software\Classes
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e6] MIG Removing mapping for HKCU
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e7] MIG Successfully unmapped HKCU
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x080411] MIG Setting SMI registry mappings for system context
2009-06-13 16:11:36, Info [0x0803e2] MIG Adding indirect mapping from HKCU to <C:\Users\Brian\NTUSER.DAT> loaded at HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000 (R/W)
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e4] MIG Successfully mapped HKCU
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e2] MIG Adding indirect mapping from HKCU\Software\Classes to <C:\Users\Brian\AppData\Local\Microsoft\Windows\Usr Class.dat> loaded at HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000_Classes (R/W)
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e4] MIG Successfully mapped HKCU\Software\Classes
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x08040f] MIG Setting SMI registry mappings for user context (HKU\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000, HKU\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000_Classes)
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e6] MIG Removing mapping for HKCU\Software\Classes
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e7] MIG Successfully unmapped HKCU\Software\Classes
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e6] MIG Removing mapping for HKCU
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e7] MIG Successfully unmapped HKCU
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x080411] MIG Setting SMI registry mappings for system context
2009-06-13 16:11:41, Info [0x0803e2] MIG Adding indirect mapping from HKCU to <C:\Users\Brian\NTUSER.DAT> loaded at HKEY_USERS\S-1-5-21-1801878112-2666203872-1376552359-1000 (R/W)

No idea why. It appears to be copying a folder (or creating something like a sym link for it) in the registry, then deleting it, then recopying.

I'll probably have to do a clean install, bleh. I hate having to reinstall all my crap.

[civil]

So I've encountered my first issue: My bluetooth keeps randomly shutting off and I need to disable/enable the device to get it working again. It's annoying but I'm hoping it's one of those "crazy little quirks" that you get used to or someone changes along the way.

[Lithium Flower]

Happens to me too!

Also the new drivers for my ATI 4850 didn't fix the right-click glitching I was experiencing. I'm beginning to think 9.4 Catalyst caused the glitch in the first place.

[total]

Happens to me too!

Also the new drivers for my ATI 4850 didn't fix the right-click glitching I was experiencing. I'm beginning to think 9.4 Catalyst caused the glitch in the first place.

Did you use the ATI uninstall tool and then Drivercleaner?

If not give it another go. First uninstall the ATI drivers in add/remove or whatever it is and then use this. (http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=745)

[civil]

Happens to me too!
Here are some quick queries from Google, though my laptop is at home so I can't try anything out:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=340326
http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/3273-bluetooth-problem.html
http://www.sevenforums.com/drivers/3621-bluetooth-peripheral-device-driver.html
http://www.winvistatips.com/re-hid-data-has-stopped-working-bluetooth-mouse-error-t171598.html

[Lithium Flower]

Thanks guys!

They seem to have taken down Driver Cleaner Pro 1.5, will this Guru3D Driver Sweeper recommended as an alternative fare just as well?

Civil: My generic usb bluetooth dongle only works with Blue Soleil. I've got that and it's working fine...sort of. Only that it just turns off on its own after a little while.

[cp#]

My XP install on my desktop starting being a mother fucker so I switched to Windows 7 yesterday. I was already running it on the laptop so I already knew what I was getting into.

I love it! I don't know what the fuck happened to my XP install but the boot time was over a minute and then it took another minute or two for everything to 'warm up.' Now I'm boot to a fully loaded desktop in under a minute. TF2 performance seems the same. The interface is leaps and bounds above XP and Vista (I used Vista for over a year). Mainly due to the new taskbar.

[Wraith]

Running Windows 7 on ancient hardware: Windows 7 Hits a New Low (http://www.pcworld.com/article/166992/windows_7_hits_a_new_low.html) (PC World)

Guy managed to get Win7 installed on a PII 266MHz with 96MB RAM.

[muddi900]

Yeah, so I finally installed the RC since the Beta expires next week. Something weird happened to the Windows explorer. It doesn't show changes until I refresh. Is it just me?

[Lithium Flower]

No issues with Windows 7 RC on my end, so I'm guessing yes. Clean out and install the latest video adapter drivers. I was facing a little glitchiness with the WHQL drivers for my 4850 but the new 9.6 release fixed all problems. Don't forget to use driver sweeper/cleaner if you go this route though.

Try reinstalling Windows from scratch, that might fix problems.

[muddi900]

The installation was a little wonky. My DVD-ROM is borked probably. USB install it is.

EDIT: Scrubbing the Ati drivers and installing new ones solved the auto-refresh problem, but the windows explorer is still borked. Any app trying to access it crashes. Like WinRar.

[Satertek]

Well damn.

http://imgur.com/Z3HAn.png

I guess I'll getting around to installing the RC tonight, clean install, since my upgrade attempts all failed.

[Wraith]

I got the RC downloaded this weekend. Currently running XP Pro / Win7 Beta dual boot, two different drives.

Should I go and do a repair XP install to fix my MBR before installing the RC, or is that not necessary? I will be backing up (most) files either way.

[Dukefrukem]

Nice. I got lucky with this. (http://www.alienware.com/microsite/windows-7/windows-7-upgrade.aspx)

[J Arcane]

Nice. I got lucky with this. (http://www.alienware.com/microsite/windows-7/windows-7-upgrade.aspx)
They also have a more detailed comparison list of the versions. Looks like I'll probably skip Ultimate, unless I can get it for cheap somehow.

With XP, I always went with Pro because the DOS support was supposed to be better, and I still used fire up old DOS games at the time.

But all the shit mentioned there is enterprise level shit I'll never use. XP Mode I want, but it only needs Pro, so that's enough to sell me on that.

[Inspector Fowler]

Here is something weird I have noticed.

On my netbook I did a clean install, since it was running the beta. On my desktop I did an upgrade install, since it was running Vista 64.

On my netbook, the boot screen is the old-school Vista green "progress bar" thingy. On my desktop, the boot screen is the Windows 7 loading thingy where the four colors fly together to form the Windows 7 loading screen.

I wonder why it would pick different ones...

[Doogie2K]

Here is something weird I have noticed.

On my netbook I did a clean install, since it was running the beta. On my desktop I did an upgrade install, since it was running Vista 64.

On my netbook, the boot screen is the old-school Vista green "progress bar" thingy. On my desktop, the boot screen is the Windows 7 loading thingy where the four colors fly together to form the Windows 7 loading screen.

I wonder why it would pick different ones...

One's more hardware-intensive than the other, maybe?

[Dukefrukem]

They also have a more detailed comparison list of the versions. Looks like I'll probably skip Ultimate, unless I can get it for cheap somehow.

With XP, I always went with Pro because the DOS support was supposed to be better, and I still used fire up old DOS games at the time.

But all the shit mentioned there is enterprise level shit I'll never use. XP Mode I want, but it only needs Pro, so that's enough to sell me on that.

What really pisses me off about Vista and 7 is they haven't implemented USB networking like you can do in XP. I'm thinking they did this because it was so easy to share files that way.

[Crittias]

I just downloaded the RTM version of W7 via MSDN. Gonna load it up on my laptop tonight/tomorrow and see how it goes.

Anyone else get their hands on the RTM version?

[Satertek]

I just downloaded the RTM version of W7 via MSDN. Gonna load it up on my laptop tonight/tomorrow and see how it goes.

Anyone else get their hands on the RTM version?

I'm downloading it right now from MSDNAA.

If you're in some computer related degree at a university, be sure to check and see if they're a MSDN Academic Alliance member. You'll be able to get Windows 7 (and Visual Studio, and pretty much any other MS product other than Office) for free :cool:

[Doogie2K]

I'm downloading it right now from MSDNAA.

If you're in some computer related degree at a university, be sure to check and see if they're a MSDN Academic Alliance member. You'll be able to get Windows 7 (and Visual Studio, and pretty much any other MS product other than Office) for free :cool:

I got MSDN copies of Windows 2000 and Office 2000 back when I was at DeVry. I wonder if I still have access? I know a friend of mine does because he works in IT, but I haven't been in a technical degree program since 2003, so...

[Shjinta]

Anyone have issues with Window 7 boot times? I rebooted my Machine today and it sat at the loading windows screen for 10 minutes, then went to a black screen with my mouse cursor... which is where it is now... I installed 32 Bit RC last night no problems.. now I get this shit.

[MachEnergy]

Anyone have issues with Window 7 boot times? I rebooted my Machine today and it sat at the loading windows screen for 10 minutes, then went to a black screen with my mouse cursor... which is where it is now... I installed 32 Bit RC last night no problems.. now I get this shit.

I had run the 32bit version since the RC 7100 build, and had like zero problems. About a month ago, I reformatted and installed the 64bit. It started out working fine, but recently I've been having major issues. First of all, Google Desktop won't install. Then I start having LogMeIn crash all the time. I usually keep my system on 24/7, and I've been coming home to find it rebooted, with no sign of power loss on my UPS. Just two days ago, Picassa froze, and no matter what I did, I could not terminate a single process. I hard-powered down and rebooted, where it stayed at a black screen for a few minutes before the blue Win7 loading screen showed up.

I was thinking that maybe I don't really want to go the 64bit route when Win7 ships. Now you have me thinking that maybe there was just a bad update as of recent....at least for my lock up/restart woes.

[Shjinta]

I had run the 32bit version since the RC 7100 build, and had like zero problems. About a month ago, I reformatted and installed the 64bit. It started out working fine, but recently I've been having major issues. First of all, Google Desktop won't install. Then I start having LogMeIn crash all the time. I usually keep my system on 24/7, and I've been coming home to find it rebooted, with no sign of power loss on my UPS. Just two days ago, Picassa froze, and no matter what I did, I could not terminate a single process. I hard-powered down and rebooted, where it stayed at a black screen for a few minutes before the blue Win7 loading screen showed up.

I was thinking that maybe I don't really want to go the 64bit route when Win7 ships. Now you have me thinking that maybe there just a bad update as of recent....at least for my lock up/restart woes.


Yeah odd. I think the problem is my Hard Drives. I have 2 750 WDs SATA 2. Basically my secondary drive after Windows 7 takes 25 minutes to boot is missing. I reboot hit the BIOS its not there. Unplug and replug the SATA cord to my board and the BIOS sees it again but Windows takes 20 minutes to boot and when it does the HDD is gone again. I tried swapping ports. No luck.. wtf is going on