L4DLC4Free (L4D DLC Free) on Both PC and Xbox 360

[fitbabits]

Oh, Valve... You make it so easy for people to like you and everything you do. I mean, you could easily have charged 800 Microsoft Points for the upcoming L4D Survival Pack downloadable content on PC and Xbox 360, but instead you decide you're going to give it away for free. No points, no currency of any kind will change hands for the DLC pack.

Included in the spring 2009 pack will be one new multiplayer mode entitled "Survival" along with two complete campaigns for Versus Mode (Death Toll, Dead Air).

Also releasing in the spring will be a Left 4 Dead Critic's Choice Edition, which will include the game plus the above-mentioned DLC.

Valve - we at Colony of Gamers salute you!

[Ancalagon]

Thats awesome!

I hate to be cliched here in attacking Microsoft, but I wonder what negotiation was required on Valve's part? I mean, we know the pack would be free on Steam (I thought that was pretty much a given), and we also know that MS isnt too fond of free DLC. Sorry, but they arent, there hasnt been a lot of it in the life of the console. So how did Valve succeed where Epic failed?

[Sandman]

..........

no words, should have brought a poet.

[fitbabits]

Thats awesome!

I hate to be cliched here in attacking Microsoft, but I wonder what negotiation was required on Valve's part? I mean, we know the pack would be free on Steam (I thought that was pretty much a given), and we also know that MS isnt too fond of free DLC. Sorry, but they arent, there hasnt been a lot of it in the life of the console. So how did Valve succeed where Epic failed?
Have you seen Gabe Newell? Given the choice of five-finger negotiating between Gabe and Mark Rein at Epic, I'll take my chances with Mark. :)

[Food Nipple]

So how did Valve succeed where Epic failed?

I think Epic didn't have much bargaining leverage when Microsoft was publishing their games. EA publishes Valve's retail games, which gives them a greater advantage at the bargaining table. EA also has some experience negotiating deals like this; Burnout Paradise, the paragon of free DLC is an EA game.

[Nura]

Sounds good, but i still don't like Valve. They still need to fix the "localized currency" on the steamstore.

[roboninja]

Good news for our 360 brethren! Valve is the tops.

[Telefrog]

I think Epic didn't have much bargaining leverage when Microsoft was publishing their games.

Basically, this. When it's Microsoft's game, it's their call.

[Talanvor]

Wow, good on you Valve!

[Vermillion]

I'm actually pretty impressed. I would have paid for it. I do love me some L4D.

Now if they could just make a mod where they make Food one of the normal zombies on every mission, then I'd be gleeful... :)

[Wilkz07]

I had assumed it would be free for PC but to see that its also free for 360 is amazing. I will continute to buy Valve products.

[Ten19]

Impressive.

Most impressive.

[cp#]

Free. Can't complain. Looking forward to this and the Scout update

[Hotcod]

i love valve so damned much... at some point i'm going to fly over and turn up every day to there offices until they give me some kind of job, any kind of job, with them.

[Purple Santa]

i love valve so damned much... at some point i'm going to fly over and turn up every day to there offices until they give me some kind of job, any kind of job, with them.

I believe this kind of love and affection is considered stalking ;)

I'm really interested in the survival mode...I need to get a copy of L4D again...

[ThievesAmongUs]

"No words... so beautiful... should have sent a... poet...":D

[Jackel]

Excellent News. Valve comes through again as always.

[DoctorFinger]

The acronyms...they burn my eyes!

[fitbabits]

The acronyms...they burn my eyes!
They burned my brain when I was composing the post.

I was going to go with L4DLC43, with the three representing 'free', but I decided against it. :)

[Hotcod]

I believe this kind of love and affection is considered stalking ;)

it's only stalking if they don't give me a job

[fitbabits]

it's only stalking if they don't give me a job
...and you're caught doing it.

[Sandman]

"No words... so beautiful... should have sent a... poet...":D

Yeah, I beat you to that by like 13 posts.

[Widgetcraft]

They make it really easy to buy their games.

[fitbabits]

They make it really easy to buy their games.
Ain't that the mother-loving truth.

[agentgray]

To Valve:

fzllVlzzeuo

you just break my heart into a million pieces. Love.

[hunterx280]

I was happy to hear this claimed in a press release. Making it official to the world really helps. I would have grudgingly paid for this content because I really love playing Left 4 Dead and more VS maps will only make this game better. I know Valve is known for their free content but a lot of companies seem to be testing the waters with weird pay schemes to see what they can get away with in microtransactions. I'm glad they decided this wasn't the time to try that strategy.

[Iron Past]

It's weird. I'm not trying to rain on the happy parade--I think this is awesome--but this is releasing I'm assuming pretty close together time-wise on both platforms and for free, but TF2 on X360 still hasn't gotten the updates the PC has and when they finally do release it it's going to be charged for. What's different?

[TheKeck]

Valve, how could I have doubted you?!

[Mdot]

Sweet digital justice.

[Dukefrukem]

In this economic times, this is fucking awesome.

[Sandman]

It's weird. I'm not trying to rain on the happy parade--I think this is awesome--but this is releasing I'm assuming pretty close together time-wise on both platforms and for free, but TF2 on X360 still hasn't gotten the updates the PC has and when they finally do release it it's going to be charged for. What's different?

I don't know of anyone that plays TF2 on 360, that's what is different.

[Khrymsyn]

So they're going to open up the two campaigns to Vs. that should have been out of the box and a "survivor" mode that's basically the rescue missions... but timed for free and everyone's sucking on the teat?

Look, I'm THRILLED it will be free, but should have at least half of this been in the game to start with anyway? If they'd have charged money for something that should have been in the game, that would have been BS.

[cp#]

Valve, how could I have doubted you?!

cuz ur a maget

[CES]

Thats awesome!

I hate to be cliched here in attacking Microsoft, but I wonder what negotiation was required on Valve's part? I mean, we know the pack would be free on Steam (I thought that was pretty much a given), and we also know that MS isnt too fond of free DLC. Sorry, but they arent, there hasnt been a lot of it in the life of the console. So how did Valve succeed where Epic failed?

Because Valve have always been pretty cosy with Microsoft since Valve was founded.

[ThievesAmongUs]

So they're going to open up the two campaigns to Vs. that should have been out of the box and a "survivor" mode that's basically the rescue missions... but timed for free and everyone's sucking on the teat?

Look, I'm THRILLED it will be free, but should have at least half of this been in the game to start with anyway? If they'd have charged money for something that should have been in the game, that would have been BS.

True, but the fact that this is free, does negate allot of my resentment towards Valve for not doing that out of the box.

[crazyD]

So they're going to open up the two campaigns to Vs. that should have been out of the box and a "survivor" mode that's basically the rescue missions... but timed for free and everyone's sucking on the teat?

Look, I'm THRILLED it will be free, but should have at least half of this been in the game to start with anyway? If they'd have charged money for something that should have been in the game, that would have been BS.

Why? Why should it have been included out of the box? Because you wanted it to be included out of the box? I felt I got my money's worth from my original purchase, and free extras along the line are just icing.

[Morangie]

Sounds good, but i still don't like Valve. They still need to fix the "localized currency" on the steamstore.

If by "fix" you mean revert back to only selling in dollars, then dear god no. Localized currency is the lubrication to the anal intrusion that is steam pricing.

[Disgustipated]

Because Valve have always been pretty cosy with Microsoft since Valve was founded.

It couldn't be that way because Valve is made up of former Microsoft execs, could it...? Naw.

[MagGnome]

There was little doubt in my mind that this would be free for PC gamers, but I'm glad to see that 360 owners will get to enjoy this without charge as well.

The PC has always been a haven of free downloads and updates, and it's nice that this sort of thing has slowly trickled down to the consoles.

[Nura]

If by "fix" you mean revert back to only selling in dollars, then dear god no. Localized currency is the lubrication to the anal intrusion that is steam pricing.

Because you're from the UK :P Here in Denmark all their prices are retail +50% aprox :(

[Psykoboy2]

So they're going to open up the two campaigns to Vs. that should have been out of the box and a "survivor" mode that's basically the rescue missions... but timed for free and everyone's sucking on the teat?

Look, I'm THRILLED it will be free, but should have at least half of this been in the game to start with anyway? If they'd have charged money for something that should have been in the game, that would have been BS.

I'm thinking this as well. The 2 other maps anyway should have been included upon release or given as free DLC - which they are doing now.

Everything in this DLC seems to scream "Hey, we couldn't get this in before deadline so here it is as DLC, and it's free cause well, it should have been in there when you originally bought it."

[crazyD]

I'm thinking this as well. The 2 other maps anyway should have been included upon release or given as free DLC - which they are doing now.

Everything in this DLC seems to scream "Hey, we couldn't get this in before deadline so here it is as DLC, and it's free cause well, it should have been in there when you originally bought it."

I really don't understand the sense of entitlement here. Why should it have been in there when we bought it?

[Psykoboy2]

Cause it's in there already, just not in this "form". I mean, both maps are already in there. If we can play the first and the forth in versus, why couldn't we play the second and third as well?

Survival is a bit of a different story depending on how they set that up. If indeed it is the rescue mission except on a timer, then yeah...again it's something already in the game, just in a different "form".

[JayK47]

This is great and all, but considering what is in the update, I believe it was intended to ship with the retail version. I consider this a patch, not DLC. So yes, it should be free.

[crazyD]

Cause it's in there already, just not in this "form". I mean, both maps are already in there. If we can play the first and the forth in versus, why couldn't we play the second and third as well?

Survival is a bit of a different story depending on how they set that up. If indeed it is the rescue mission except on a timer, then yeah...again it's something already in the game, just in a different "form".

Yeah, but modifications are necessary to make them work in VS. Maybe they underestimated the appeal of VS while making the game, but I still don't see why they should have been included at launch.

[AbeLincoln]

If you really pay attention to the maps they're different for versus and regular campaign, they have to make alterations for balance. So that's probably why it didn't make it in, also I think they really wanted the focus to be on co-op rather than versus.

2nd on the topic of survival. From the gametrailers preview it sounded like there were going to be more than just 4 maps(meaning the 4 rescues). I'm remembering 20 but I can't check at work to be sure. So it'll probably all the sections of the campaigns, and maybe they've again altered the maps in some way so as to work for this mode, all of which takes time.

And CrazyD beats me while also being more concise...

[Admiral Ackbar]

I am very pleased, but now I realize I gambled wrong. I was betting that the 360 version would have pay DLC so I bought PC even though all my friends play on 360. Now, I am sad (but happy).

[Johan]

This is great and all, but considering what is in the update, I believe it was intended to ship with the retail version. I consider this a patch, not DLC. So yes, it should be free.

This is what it sounds like to me, as well.

[Hotcod]

This is what it sounds like to me, as well.

it may well be but the sad truth is that most devs would have charged for it anyway. It also sets a president for future DLC. By not calling it a patch and giving it out for free it makes it harder for them to go on to sell any future content.

[violent]

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/8934/verucasaltmx6.jpg

[Gerbs]

Awesome. Bring it on. I had my doubts, glad I was wrong.

[mister slim]

2nd on the topic of survival. From the gametrailers preview it sounded like there were going to be more than just 4 maps(meaning the 4 rescues). I'm remembering 20 but I can't check at work to be sure. So it'll probably all the sections of the campaigns, and maybe they've again altered the maps in some way so as to work for this mode, all of which takes time.

It might just be the 20 campaign chapters in a random order, with continuously escalating difficulty. Just loop it and see how many chapters a team can get through.

[cp#]

Cause it's in there already, just not in this "form". I mean, both maps are already in there. If we can play the first and the forth in versus, why couldn't we play the second and third as well?

Survival is a bit of a different story depending on how they set that up. If indeed it is the rescue mission except on a timer, then yeah...again it's something already in the game, just in a different "form".

Because they haven't been properly balanced for versus play? Now that Valve thinks the content is ready, they will release it to us. Don't think of it has DLC (which has a negative connotation), but as updates. It's what Valve has been doing with their multi-player games since as far as I can remember.

[WhyThree]

Why a Critic's Choice edition if the only additions are things you can get for free? To save 10 minutes of downloading?

[Psykoboy2]

Why a Critic's Choice edition if the only additions are things you can get for free? To save 10 minutes of downloading?

Well, may be a few reasons.

1.) Not everyone has internet connections with their 360 (but then why buy a primarily online game?)

2.) These things were intended to be in the game in the first place but didn't make the deadline.

3.) I dunno and that's a good question.

[Gerbs]

Why a Critic's Choice edition if the only additions are things you can get for free? To save 10 minutes of downloading?

People who don't yet own the game but have heard about it from friends. They're at EB and see "that zombie game" on the shelf with a huge CRITIC'S CHOICE label on it. Maybe they buy it and tell their other non-core gamer friends about it.

Also what Psykoboy said about the no internet access.

[Orca]

Well, may be a few reasons.

1.) Not everyone has internet connections with their 360 (but then why buy a primarily online game?)

2.) These things were intended to be in the game in the first place but didn't make the deadline.

3.) I dunno and that's a good question.

A new box on the shelf gets put back into the prime space.

[J Arcane]

A new box on the shelf gets put back into the prime space.
One that negates as much patch time once the user gets it home as well.

I doubt this new SKU was aimed at existing players, but rather at new ones.

[Wolvie]

With this move, Valve is standing shoulder to shoulder with Bungie.


Well played Valve, well played.

[Disgustipated]

With this move, Valve is standing shoulder to shoulder with Bungie.


Well played Valve, well played.

Uh? Valve stands head AND shoulders above Bungie, and has for years. ;)

[Primus]

Uh? Valve stands head AND shoulders above Bungie, and has for years. ;)

To the subjective PC gamer :)

[MagGnome]

Because they haven't been properly balanced for versus play? Now that Valve thinks the content is ready, they will release it to us. Don't think of it has DLC (which has a negative connotation), but as updates. It's what Valve has been doing with their multi-player games since as far as I can remember.

Exactly. This isn't anything new, and the only reason it's being slapped with the "DLC" term is because of the 360.

[Khrymsyn]

I really don't understand the sense of entitlement here. Why should it have been in there when we bought it?

So you're saying that Vs. is just fine being pretty much the same 2 hours of playtime over... and over... and over again for the price of $60?

Perhaps the fact that the campaigns and system are already for the most part in place and included in the game is why some of us feel it should have been included?

Or perhaps what you're saying is you love the current trend of games becoming shorter and shorter, "shipping" with less and less content, at the same higher prices, only to have things that could have/should have been included at the beginning to be charged for later?

Look, if I buy a new car, and included is an air-conditioner... I don't expect to have to pay another fee to have the air-conditioner work on the weekends, when it's already in the car and working just fine during the week.

I am HAPPY that Valve is releasing this update for free. It's a "Good thing". I've just gotten tired that Console games are now no different than PC games in the rush to "ship now, patch later", as other than the new survival mode, this seems more like a patch than an expansion.

Now, if they added a new campaign and it was released for free? I'd have the chapstick in my hand and my lips pursed at the ready.

[Ink Asylum]

I'm definitely looking forward to playing through Death Toll in Vs. There are a lot of great set pieces in that campaign I can't wait to try out as the Infected.

[Telefrog]

If you really pay attention to the maps they're different for versus and regular campaign, they have to make alterations for balance. So that's probably why it didn't make it in, also I think they really wanted the focus to be on co-op rather than versus.

Well, if you really pay attention the 2 campaigns already have the hooks and modifications to play in versus mode. In fact, there are some servers that run them now. They are a little rough, and definitely not balanced, but all the components are already there.

I'm glad this update is free, I really am, but I do think this is all stuff that was supposed to ship with the basic game and Valve just didn't have the time to refine it before the deadline. I'm glad they're correcting that, but I'm also not going to praise Valve to the heavens for making good on what should've been there in the first place.

Now, if in a later update Valve wants to add another campaign or more special Infected, then you'll see me really celebrate.

Edit: Ha! Khrymsyn had the same sentiments!

[Planetbuster]

Thanks Valve....you seem to know how to brew some customer loyalty that will probably mean your continued success, especially when the economy turns around and people can give you even more money....call me fanboi now....and I dont even play TF. I will be buying it for the PC as well because of this.

And quit hating on L4D....it truly is one of the funnest games ive ever played on my 360...sheesh what do you guys want? a $5 dollar game that gives you a BJ and promises you 1000 virgins in the afterlife along with being a great game? If your not happy with it, go make me a game thats better......

[Morangie]

With this move, Valve is standing shoulder to shoulder with Bungie.


Well played Valve, well played.

Because Valve release content for free and Bungie... don't? One of the maps in the next H3 map pack is just an empty space (for use in forge) and they're charging for it.

So you're saying that Vs. is just fine being pretty much the same 2 hours of playtime over... and over... and over again for the price of $60?

If you paid the $60, then you obviously were ok with it.

Look, if I buy a new car, and included is an air-conditioner... I don't expect to have to pay another fee to have the air-conditioner work on the weekends, when it's already in the car and working just fine during the week.

If you buy a car without air-conditioning then you shouldn't be whining if the dealership comes back to you in a few months and upgrades your car for free.

I am HAPPY that Valve is releasing this update for free. It's a "Good thing". I've just gotten tired that Console games are now no different than PC games in the rush to "ship now, patch later", as other than the new survival mode, this seems more like a patch than an expansion.

L4D is a PC game. It isn't Valve's fault if some people chose to slum it on the 360.

[Telefrog]

If you buy a car without air-conditioning then you shouldn't be whining if the dealership comes back to you in a few months and upgrades your car for free.

The analogy doesn't quite fit because every car buyer (should) knows that AC is never a "freebie" on a car. If it's standard, it's built into the price. As consumers, we've been trained by auto manufacturers to expect to pay a premium for AC.

In this case, most everyone expected that all the campaigns would be playable in Versus Mode. When it was announced that only half would be playable in that mode, people were upset until Chet indicated that they would likely be made playable at a later date. To be fair, he didn't mention price, but everyone assumed it would be free and no one at Valve corrected that assumption.

This is actually more like your new car only coming with half the seats. Sure, the car company wasn't obligated to give you the other two seats for free and you probably shouldn't have bought the car with the expectation that the seats would be added for free, but people go with what they know and new paradigms weird them out.

[J Arcane]

The Internet. Complaining about free stuff since 1977.

[cp#]

Telefrog, what is your fucking problem?

It's a safe bet to assume that Valve wanted to ship with Dead Air and Death Toll for versus, but they couldn't meet that deadline. Now that it's done they are releasing it (for free as always planned). That's all there is to it now SHUT THE FUCK UP. Expect more free L4D updates.

[Johan]

That's all there is to it now SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Now THIS is the basis for a conversation! :D

*popcorn*

[Telefrog]

Telefrog, what is your fucking problem?

It's a safe bet to assume that Valve wanted to ship with Dead Air and Death Toll for versus, but they couldn't meet that deadline. Now that it's done they are releasing it (for free as always planned). That's all there is to it now SHUT THE FUCK UP. Expect more free L4D updates.

:confused:

You agree with my theory that Valve always meant to ship the game with four full versus campaigns, but somehow that has raised your ire? Did I miss something? Did I insult Valve or you?

I said I'm glad the update is free. I'm not sure what else you want from me. A personal love letter to Gabe Newall notarized and posted on the net?

[MagGnome]

:confused:

You agree with my theory that Valve always meant to ship the game with four full versus campaigns, but somehow that has raised your ire? Did I miss something? Did I insult Valve or you?

I said I'm glad the update is free. I'm not sure what else you want from me. A personal love letter to Gabe Newall notarized and posted on the net?

I know a notary. We can make this happen. :D

[Libuke]

The Internet. Complaining about free stuff since 1977.

I'm going to have to agree with you on this, why do some people seem unhappy that they are getting these updates?

Yes it would of been nice to have all four campaigns set up for verses but if anything valve likes to do a lot of balance before they release things and if they felt the 2 campaigns would suck for versus and no one would play them then what would be the point of shipping them out?

Should the TF2 updates been there at release?

[violent]

I'm going to have to agree with you on this, why do some people seem unhappy that they are getting these updates?

Because the way some people enjoy playing games does not require a controller.

[Wolvie]

I guess I should have added "in my book" to my previous pst so I wouldn't offend anyone. That's the key to my statement, IMO Bungie was better then Valve for years(Half-Life 2 wasn't really my bag).
But after Portal, and L4D? They are now shoulder to shoulder with Bungie IN MY OPINION.

See I don't mistake my opinion as fact. :D

Because Valve release content for free and Bungie... don't? One of the maps in the next H3 map pack is just an empty space (for use in forge) and they're charging for it.


No because they are now officially a kick ass company in my book. See the above response for more info.

L4D is a PC game. It isn't Valve's fault if some people chose to slum it on the 360.

No L4D IS a multi-platform game. And those people you speak of that decided to grace consoles with L4D's godliness was VALVE! You know, the company you hold in such high regard? Yeah, they actually wanted to make money on this game, so they released it on a another platform so that they would move more units. How evil! :eek:

Edit: At any rate, Valve rules for releasing free content for a awesome game. And Bungie is awesome for giving me Halo. Sure the only map they give out for free is Cold Storage... but hey nobody's perfect. Bedsides, they gave me Halo, so I'll call it even. :D

[MagGnome]

Because the way some people enjoy playing games does not require a controller.

Keyboard and mouse, woohoo!


Oh wait, I see what you did there... :p

[Morangie]

No L4D IS a multi-platform game. And those people you speak of that decided to grace consoles with L4D's godliness was VALVE! You know, the company you hold in such high regard? Yeah, they actually wanted to make money on this game, so they released it on a another platform so that they would move more units. How evil! :eek:

You seem to be a little confused here. L4D is a PC game which was then ported to consoles, in the same way that a game like Dead Space was a console game ported to the PC. Both were released on PC and consoles at the same time but the development to get to that multi-platform release came from two different directions.

And it really isn't just an opinion that if you want the best version of a Valve game you buy it on the PC. Go ask both the guys playing TF2 on the 360 if you want to know why.

[Telefrog]

I'm going to have to agree with you on this, why do some people seem unhappy that they are getting these updates?

See, I don't think anyone (except the insane) are unhappy with Valve over getting a free update. Free is good.

I'll say it again because people keep misinterpreting my message as some kind of accusation against Valve. Free is good.

I'm just tired of everyone falling all over themselves to give Valve a virtual BJ when what they're doing is getting the game updated to the original intent: Four complete Versus campaigns.

The update is free. I'm happy it's free, but it's also what we should expect anyway. That many of us are now pleasantly surprised by getting a free update is indicative of how successfully publishers have gotten us trained to expect otherwise, even on the PC.

I find that sad and telling.

[crazyD]

I'm just tired of everyone falling all over themselves to give Valve a virtual BJ when what they're doing is getting the game updated to the original intent: Four complete Versus campaigns.

The update is free. I'm happy it's free, but it's also what we should expect anyway. That many of us are now pleasantly surprised by getting a free update is indicative of how successfully publishers have gotten us trained to expect otherwise, even on the PC.

I find that sad and telling.

Q: How do you know that was their original intent?
A: You don't.

I would guess that they just did not expect VS mode would be as popular as it is, and did not feel the need to release the same content for it.

[fitbabits]

I swear some people just love to complain about anything and everything, good or bad.

[Telefrog]

Q: How do you know that was their original intent?
A: You don't.

Unh... The fact that the Versus hooks are actually already there in the existing maps? The fact that there are servers that run them right now? The fact that Chet originally said so, then had to correct himself in a later interview when it became obvious that the maps weren't balanced well?

[Libuke]

I guess I should have added "in my book" to my previous pst so I wouldn't offend anyone. That's the key to my statement, IMO Bungie was better then Valve for years(Half-Life 2 wasn't really my bag).
But after Portal, and L4D? They are now shoulder to shoulder with Bungie IN MY OPINION.

I never thought Halo was so great, I guess it was good for FPS on the console but it didn't do anything new that people hadn't seen before. Bungie's truly good stuff was the Myth games, they were orginal, good game play wise, had a good online set up, had a great story and they were pretty well received (I thought) by putting a great twist on the RTS genre. A twist no one but ground control tried to use. I never understood why because I though lots of people liked Myth and the way it played.


See, I don't think anyone (except the insane) are unhappy with Valve over getting a free update. Free is good.

I'll say it again because people keep misinterpreting my message as some kind of accusation against Valve. Free is good.

I'm just tired of everyone falling all over themselves to give Valve a virtual BJ when what they're doing is getting the game updated to the original intent: Four complete Versus campaigns.

The update is free. I'm happy it's free, but it's also what we should expect anyway. That many of us are now pleasantly surprised by getting a free update is indicative of how successfully publishers have gotten us trained to expect otherwise, even on the PC.

I find that sad and telling.

I don't know, many of us just assumed it was going to be free after all the free stuff we have been and will be continuing to get for TF2.

I think some people are happy about it because they are not used to free stuff, like you mentioned, and being charged for stuff that was probably cut from the game on purpose so it could be charged for later.

[Telefrog]

I think some people are happy about it because they are not used to free stuff, like you mentioned, and being charged for stuff that was probably cut from the game on purpose so it could be charged for later.

Exactly! Which is why I find it so sad and telling for fans of this hobby. :(

[Libuke]

Exactly! Which is why I find it so sad and telling for fans of this hobby. :(

I probably should of added, valve hasn't done anything like that yet so I was not worried. That could change in the future but for now when it involves valve I fell safe that I won't be getting screwed.

[Ink Asylum]

When it comes to free downloadable content that seems to complete a game, there are three options: Delay the game, release DLC later, or just cut the unfinished content forever. The first is a decision often out of the hands of the developers and frustrates fans, while no one wants the last to happen. The middle option is the happy medium for everyone. Publishers get the game out to meet internal deadlines, developers get the time to polish content without rushing, and players get the vast majority of content up front and the rest for free later.

There are plenty of games that have released with content cut out that was never completed. I'm glad that Valve is willing to continue working on a released game when they could've easily declared Left 4 Dead complete and moved on to a different product.

[Wolvie]

You seem to be a little confused here. L4D is a PC game which was then ported to consoles, in the same way that a game like Dead Space was a console game ported to the PC. Both were released on PC and consoles at the same time but the development to get to that multi-platform release came from two different directions.

No I think you're confused. That's like saying a game is 360 title because they developed it on a 360 dev kit, then they had a second team port that game for the PS3 and released them at the same time.
Ya know what that's called? A multi-platform game. No matter which way you spin it, that's not gonna change just because Valve is a PC-centric company. All games start out on a PC anyways, and get coded for whatever platform they will be intended for.

I mean seriously, if we used your logic ALL games would be PC ports.

I swear some people just love to complain about anything and everything, good or bad.

Tell me about it. "OH TEH NOES! TEH CONSOLES GET TEH FREE CONTENT! I AM TEH ANGRY!"

I never thought Halo was so great, I guess it was good for FPS on the console but it didn't do anything new that people hadn't seen before. Bungie's truly good stuff was the Myth games, they were orginal, good game play wise, had a good online set up, had a great story and they were pretty well received (I thought) by putting a great twist on the RTS genre. A twist no one but ground control tried to use. I never understood why because I though lots of people liked Myth and the way it played.

Hey that's cool, what you say about Myth is how I feel about Halo. It's all good. :)

Also, I think the reason this content is free is because Valve wanted to have all four maps for versus mode, but didn't have the time to put this content in. This is truly a case when the content they are putting out should have been on the disk at launch.
I bet the next batch of DLC for L4D will cost us money... at least us Xbox people. *sigh*

[Morangie]

No I think you're confused. That's like saying a game is 360 title because they developed it on a 360 dev kit, then they had a second team port that game for the PS3 and released them at the same time.
Ya know what that's called? A multi-platform game. No matter which way you spin it, that's not gonna change just because Valve is a PC-centric company. All games start out on a PC anyways, and get coded for whatever platform they will be intended for.

I mean seriously, if we used your logic ALL games would be PC ports.

Are you intentionally being dense? I'm talking about which system is the lead platform, the system the developer builds the game around.

L4D is a game designed for PC and ported to the console. Think of it as being adapted for console if you really have such a hard time with the word port. Having just been playing FEAR 2, its very obvious it was designed for the console first and the PC second because little things, like the in-game menus, are set up for controller navigation rather than mouse.

Tell me about it. "OH TEH NOES! TEH CONSOLES GET TEH FREE CONTENT! I AM TEH ANGRY!"

Are you confusing another thread with this one? I don't see anyone here angry that the DLC is free on the consoles. Surprised, maybe.

[MagGnome]

Having just been playing FEAR 2, its very obvious it was designed for the console first and the PC second because little things, like the in-game menus, are set up for controller navigation rather than mouse

Is that true? If so, all I have to say is ugh.

[pomeroy]

Is that true? If so, all I have to say is ugh.

Why is developing for a console first such a bad thing? I'm being serious, here.

[J Arcane]

Why is developing for a console first such a bad thing? I'm being serious, here.
Because it is often the case of console ports on the PC that they are poorly adapted to the change of hardware and I/O devices. Awkward menu systems, poor interfaces, and dismal performance, are pretty much par for the course with a lot of ports of console games to the PC.

In fact, the irony of the argument about L4D's originating platform is that while it was technically developed with PC as a lead platform, I felt that the menu system in particular seemed an awful lot like a console port to me, and longed for the standard Steam interface.

[MagGnome]

Why is developing for a console first such a bad thing? I'm being serious, here.

J Arcane pretty much covered it. I'd also add that Monolith used to be one of my favorite PC publishers back in the day, so to have them treat the platform as 2nd tier is really disappointing.

[Wolvie]

Are you intentionally being dense? I'm talking about which system is the lead platform, the system the developer builds the game around.

Yes I get it, L4D is a game that started development for the PC and then got "ported" to the 360 and they released both at the same time. It doesn't matter which platform they coded first, it doesn't make the game inferior, or "slummed" as your original post made it sound like. L4D is simply a great multi-platform game no matter what system you play it on. Now do you get what I'm saying?

Besides, I've heard PC folk say the menu system on the PC is very "console-ish" like this fine fellow:

I felt that the menu system in particular seemed an awful lot like a console port to me, and longed for the standard Steam interface.

See? So to me it's obvious that the game was "designed" for both PC and 360, not "adapted" as an afterthought for the 360.

Are you confusing another thread with this one? I don't see anyone here angry that the DLC is free on the consoles. Surprised, maybe.

Hey Fitty saw all the griping too, so I'm not alone in this.

[Morangie]

Is that true? If so, all I have to say is ugh.

Yeah. The gameplay itself is fine, if a little easy. But the in-game menus are straight from the console.

Yes I get it, L4D is a game that started development for the PC and then got "ported" to the 360 and they released both at the same time. It doesn't matter which platform they coded first, it doesn't make the game inferior, or "slummed" as your original post made it sound like. L4D is simply a great multi-platform game no matter what system you play it on. Now do you get what I'm saying?

Again, if you want the best version of a Valve game you buy it on the PC. Again, go ask both guys playing TF2 on the 360 if you want to know why.

Hey Fitty saw all the griping too, so I'm not alone in this.

Theres centainly a few people complaining that this content being free isn't a cause for celebration when its just the maps that were intended to be in at launch. I haven't seen anyone getting angry that the consoles are getting free content.

[Wolvie]

Again, if you want the best version of a Valve game you buy it on the PC. Again, go ask both guys playing TF2 on the 360 if you want to know why.

I don't know, I've played Half-Life 2 on PC and 360, and I've seen little difference. As for L4D, I haven't played on both, but from what I've heard the games only difference is the level of graphical detail. The 360's seem to be set at medium, or so I've been told.

Other then the graphics thing, I personally think it comes down to whether you want the convenience of a game that works every time(unless your 360 RRoD's), or you want super sharp detailed visuals and mods. Also there's always the debate between the controller and keyboard/mouse... which I won't get into here, that's another thread.

I chose convenience and the controller, and I get the same experience as you with inferior graphics. But since I don't have to hassle with anything, and get to use a comfortable controller? I call it even. :)

Theres centainly a few people complaining that this content being free isn't a cause for celebration when its just the maps that were intended to be in at launch. I haven't seen anyone getting angry that the consoles are getting free content.

That's what I was driving at. I can see their point that MS charges for some things that may or may not be charged for. But I'm just happy I'm getting some cool free stuff for a great game. Hopefully Valve can keep all content for L4D free... but I'm not holding my breath.

[Shadowstorm]

Because Valve release content for free and Bungie... don't? One of the maps in the next H3 map pack is just an empty space (for use in forge) and they're charging for it.

Clearly, you haven't played Halo 3 in awhile. The map you are speaking about is called Foundry and has been free for awhile, since it is in the Heroic map pack.

[Wolvie]

Clearly, you haven't played Halo 3 in awhile. The map you are speaking about is called Foundry and has been free for awhile, since it is in the Heroic map pack.

And those "empty spaces" he was speaking about have pre-set default layouts. It's just that you can take them apart and rebuild them as however you want. Yeah I'm guessing the guy hasn't played Halo 3 in awhile, if ever. A quick Wikipedia search would have cleared that up though.

[Morangie]

I don't know, I've played Half-Life 2 on PC and 360, and I've seen little difference. As for L4D, I haven't played on both, but from what I've heard the games only difference is the level of graphical detail. The 360's seem to be set at medium, or so I've been told.

Just going to carry on ignoring that crack about TF2 then?

I chose convenience and the controller, and I get the same experience as you with inferior graphics. But since I don't have to hassle with anything, and get to use a comfortable controller? I call it even. :)

Whats convenient is different for everyone but you could use a 360 controller on the PC version if you really wanted to.

That's what I was driving at. I can see their point that MS charges for some things that may or may not be charged for. But I'm just happy I'm getting some cool free stuff for a great game. Hopefully Valve can keep all content for L4D free... but I'm not holding my breath.

The Valve content will be free but you'll miss out on all the mods and community maps. PC players will be holding out in the mall while console players are still stuck in the hospital.

Clearly, you haven't played Halo 3 in awhile. The map you are speaking about is called Foundry and has been free for awhile, since it is in the Heroic map pack.

The map is called Sandbox. Its a new map in the mythic map pack, the upcoming one. You even bolded the word next in my original post so I'm unsure why you though I was talking about the previous map pack.

edit:

And those "empty spaces" he was speaking about have pre-set default layouts. It's just that you can take them apart and rebuild them as however you want. Yeah I'm guessing the guy hasn't played Halo 3 in awhile, if ever. A quick Wikipedia search would have cleared that up though.

You could skip the guessing and just look up my gamertag you know. A quick bungie.net search would show the map I'm talking about.

[Jackel]

I don't know, I've played Half-Life 2 on PC and 360, and I've seen little difference. As for L4D, I haven't played on both, but from what I've heard the games only difference is the level of graphical detail. The 360's seem to be set at medium, or so I've been told.

You clearly haven't tried the HL2 High Res Textures pack (http://halflife2.filefront.com/file/FakeFactorys_Oggs_High_Resolution_Pack;55302)


Other then the graphics thing, I personally think it comes down to whether you want the convenience of a game that works every time(unless your 360 RRoD's), or you want super sharp detailed visuals and mods. Also there's always the debate between the controller and keyboard/mouse... which I won't get into here, that's another thread.

The 360 controller (and most other common ones) work easily on L4D (plug / play). Actually you can even do split screen on the PC using 2 controllers, or 1 controller and a keyboard. It is pretty fun playing online play while still having a buddy at your side.

As for the driver issues, there is no getting around that...consoles are easier. For curiosity sake...I wonder what the comparison would be for the number of people who can't get L4D working right on PC, versus the number of red ringed consoles.

[Wolvie]

Just going to carry on ignoring that crack about TF2 then?

It's not as if I have the experience to dispute your claim. I played TF2 on the 360 a couple times. *shrugs*

Whats convenient is different for everyone but you could use a 360 controller on the PC version if you really wanted to.



The Valve content will be free but you'll miss out on all the mods and community maps. PC players will be holding out in the mall while console players are still stuck in the hospital.

I was never able to find a way to use my 360 pad on HL2.

I've been missing a lot of mods over the years, I will survive. And my PC sucks, and I doubt it would run L4D anyways...




The map is called Sandbox. Its a new map in the mythic map pack, the upcoming one. You even bolded the word next in my original post so I'm unsure why you though I was talking about the previous map pack.

edit:



You could skip the guessing and just look up my gamertag you know. A quick bungie.net search would show the map I'm talking about.

Yeah I know what map you were referring to, but you called it an "empty box" and even that even has a default setup:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/WOLVERYNE/3238317193_93b4526d6c_o.jpg

Behold! A not so empty box! KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! :p

Man I am being an asshole today. :D

You clearly haven't tried the HL2 High Res Textures pack (http://halflife2.filefront.com/file/FakeFactorys_Oggs_High_Resolution_Pack;55302)



The 360 controller (and most other common ones) work easily on L4D (plug / play). Actually you can even do split screen on the PC using 2 controllers, or 1 controller and a keyboard. It is pretty fun playing online play while still having a buddy at your side.

As for the driver issues, there is no getting around that...consoles are easier. For curiosity sake...I wonder what the comparison would be for the number of people who can't get L4D working right on PC, versus the number of red ringed consoles.

Nope, haven't tried the high-rez pack... I'm afraid my PC would assplode.

And the 360 controller works on the PC version of L4D? Well, I guess I have no excuses... oh wait my PC still sucks... :(

And as far as the ratio of glitched PC's and RRoD 360's? My guess would be, a lot.

[Morangie]

Yeah I know what map you were referring to, but you called it an "empty box" and even that even has a default setup:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/WOLVERYNE/3238317193_93b4526d6c_o.jpg

Behold! A not so empty box! KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! :p

Man I am being an asshole today. :D

I realise you're being a halo fanboy, but come on. Arranging a few boxes to create two rudimentary bases doesn't change the fact that the map is a blank canvas for use in forge, a bigger version of the first blank canvas map they managed to sell.

The only reason it has that is because if they tried to sell it with screenshots of a completely empty space, even the most devoted might start to question the faith.

[Wolvie]

I realise you're being a halo fanboy, but come on. Arranging a few boxes to create two rudimentary bases doesn't change the fact that the map is a blank canvas for use in forge, a bigger version of the first blank canvas map they managed to sell.

The only reason it has that is because if they tried to sell it with screenshots of a completely empty space, even the most devoted might start to question the faith.

Dude, I'm just fucking with ya! Didn't you see my spoiler down there, even I realize I'm being a dick. Yes I fully understand that this is a blank canvas as you called it. One that comes with all the set pieces you need to create your own map.

I guess the reason they added stuff into it in the first place was so the uncreative types, or the lazy types(me) would have something in a map they paid money for.

Edit: I guess we could debate whether or not the forge maps should be free... but that's another thread.

[tombofsoldier]

Wow, its a thread half full of self obsessed retards! I had hoped that CoG was better than other sites on the internet, but fuck me sideways if I wasn't wrong. Maybe there really isn't a place where self entitled morons don't complain about free things, but I hope to find it someday anyway.

Yes, if you complained about this you should be ashamed of yourself. Incredibly so in fact.