Blu Ray Experience...Sucks? [Archive]

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maverick106

01-02-2009, 08:01 AM

So i got a nice shiny blu ray player for Christmas. (Specifically, a Samsung BPD-1500). Fired up some Dark Knight and Planet Earth, and the people rejoiced. Beautiful picture.

However, some things have really gotten under my skin about this technology "upgrade" not feeling like much of one. Let's have a list:

1. My DVD players, every single one, can be turned off in the middle of a movie and will resume where they left off when you turn them back on and hit play. Its a nice feature we have all gotten used to (Hell, VHS tapes do the same thing, though I don't think its a "feature" in that case). The Blu Ray player, on the other hand, cannot. I'm told its java based disc content and blah blah blah, i don't really care. I also know there are bookmarks...still don't care. Why the hell would a handy feature be removed in the next generation of a technology?

2. I decided to upgrade the firmware this weekend, to be up to date. Hooked up a network cable, started the upgrade. It finished downloading, and sits there at the "installing" screen for about 2 hours. I figure this is too long, call tech support. They say "well, uh, it probably finished but forgot to turn off the machine. Go ahead and turn it off, it probably won't brick it." So I do so, and power it back up. It comes on, I go to system info and ask the tech support guy if the system version numbers indicated represent the new firmware or the factory default. His response? "I don't know. We have no way to tell". So, they have no idea what firmware ships with their product, and no idea how to identify new firmware on their product...this is one of the stupidest design decisions I can imagine. Again, I'll point out that the last gen (DVD) players just had to be plugged in and worked perfectly, no fuss at all, ever.

3. I've also read that Samsung has implemented netflix streaming on their pricier players, but haven't made any plans to implement it on the 1500 yet, even though it can received firmware updates and likely uses the same firmware base as the more expensive models. The network capabilities were a big factor in me selecting this machine...I'm starting to wonder why.

4. Last but not least, load times are irritating.

Is anyone else completely underwhelmed by the experience of upgrading to this "superior" technology? I miss the days when they had to make a far better product, with updated user experience, to get people to adopt. Its not like I got a blu ray player the day they came out...what were they like then? Did they make you spin the disc yourself?

DangerousDaze

01-02-2009, 08:08 AM

Is anyone else completely underwhelmed by the experience of upgrading to this "superior" technology?
Nope. Like it just fine.

/edit - but then again I bought a PS3. Easy to figure out firmware versions. Don't care about remembering where I was in a film. Don't think we get Netflix in the UK, and, how can you complain about not getting Netflix when you bought a player you knew doesn't do it? Load times? Not a problem.

Grifter

01-02-2009, 08:08 AM

The fancier models came with their own gerbils which was awesome until they got tired and you had to watch the movies at half the speed.

pheriannath

01-02-2009, 08:14 AM

I have no experience with players outside the PS3, which hasn't disappointed me yet.

maverick106

01-02-2009, 08:17 AM

I have no experience with players outside the PS3, which hasn't disappointed me yet.

If they had had a black friday PS3 sale for half price, that's what would be in my living room right now, I can tell you that.

frederec

01-02-2009, 08:20 AM

I know it'll sound stupid, but one of my big reasons for liking Blu-Ray is that most (but not quite all) discs I pop in go straight to the movie. No commercials, and not always the stupid warnings, just straight to the menu. Then again, I'm the sort of person that loves having AnyDVD on my computers because it allows you to ignore ads and jump straight to the movie or menu.

I don't have a very good setup, so I doubt you could even tell the difference between a Blu-Ray and a DVD on my TV. So I get them mostly because I have a PS3 and the interface tends to be better. And on my PS3 I'm pretty sure I've turned off a Blu-Ray and come back later and resumed where it left off (need to test to make sure).

It's possible that your complaint is really about your player and the company making it rather than the technology in general.

Wilkz07

01-02-2009, 08:20 AM

I researched some players before I commited and found that the PS3 was the best bang for the buck. Have had no problems at all, aside from the DL screens on some of the BD-live movies but that can be cancelled.

Strange how your player doesn't remember where to playback from when you restart. The ps3 is great for (i think creating a save file) re-playback. We watched and episode of Pushing Daises (non-bluray disc) and ejected it when credits came up, played LBP, played R6Vegas2, watched half of Ghostbusters dvd (non-bluray) then put Pushing Daises disc back in and it started where we ejected it.

- take the samsung player back and get the almight ps3. lol.

maverick106

01-02-2009, 08:31 AM

It's possible that your complaint is really about your player and the company making it rather than the technology in general.

You are absolutely correct, that is the meat of my complaint. I was surprised, because this unit received high reviews everywhere I've looked. I'm just curious where people's expectations were.

As a side note, the turn off restart thing is a known blu ray flaw. It is tied to the disc, and discs with java-based content cannot do it for one reason or another. Nearly all DVDs had the capability built into them, and most blu ray players will still do it with a DVD, just not with java-based blu ray discs.

Fubl

01-02-2009, 08:43 AM

frederec

01-02-2009, 08:48 AM

the ps3 had to have the pause/stop restart playback patched in late last year/early this year. It was my biggest gripe about the whole thing. the reaspn i replaced the Ps3 with a sony bdp-350 was that the ps3 will not bitstream to allow my receiver to take advantage of the tech built into it for the Dolby hd and such....

I do have vague recollection of a firmware update to the PS3 a few months ago allowing the pause/restart thing. Many people yelled "finally!" and "DVD's have been doing this for ages, why'd it take so long?"

Norse

01-02-2009, 08:49 AM

I haven't been disappointed in the features of Blu-ray, but the image and sound quality hasn't overwhelmed me as much as the price tag (both players and movies) suggests.

There are alot of great players out there, both from Samsung and other companies. The model you got doesn't sound like one of them unfortunately :(

KingGorilla

01-02-2009, 09:08 AM

I gotta say, from the OP, if you are buying for movies, get a Roku player. Total set top HD netflix is coming soon. Or get a "net-top" and use it as a media center- Dell makes a pretty good one. You will get much better value out of the device. DVD scaling on a PC is top notch, Netflix works great, not to mention streaming from network TV and services like Hulu. As well as video podcasts(Diggnation looks great on my TV). You get a lot of great FREE content for the price.

Goronmon

01-02-2009, 09:13 AM

I gotta say, from the OP, if you are buying for movies, get a Roku player.Netflix streaming is great if you are more about technology and less about actually watching movies. I'm sure the library is going to improve, but right now their Watch Instantly selection isn't much better than those shitty convenience stores that also happen to rent movies on the side.

Johan

01-02-2009, 09:25 AM

Netflix streaming is great if you are more about technology and less about actually watching movies. I'm sure the library is going to improve, but right now their Watch Instantly selection isn't much better than those shitty convenience stores that also happen to rent movies on the side.

This is very true. The movie (and television show) selection is ideal for someone like myself, since I don't care much about having the latest/greatest releases available to stream instantly, but I DO enjoy the family fare that is quite plentiful for instant viewing, as well as older television shows for myself. Ironically and amusingly, the people who are usually interested in technology are the ones who WANT the latest/greatest films. I'm a rare bird, I suppose, in that I like having access to streaming media on my set, but I don't care for the latest films as much as I care for having easy access to kid-friendly content.

Netflix has been good to me as a result. :)

On topic, it sounds, as others have said, like the player (make, model) itself, rather than the technology overall, is the problem.

maverick106

01-02-2009, 09:25 AM

Netflix streaming is great if you are more about technology and less about actually watching movies. I'm sure the library is going to improve, but right now their Watch Instantly selection isn't much better than those shitty convenience stores that also happen to rent movies on the side.

I have netflix streaming up and running on my 360, and I gotta say I love it. The library isn't great yet, but I've been catching up on a lot of TV shows (News Radio, Dr Who, Numbers, CSI, The Office, etc) and some movies I missed...I really can't complain. I can't wait till the library expands and this becomes the standard...its how TV and movies should work. Instant access, stop and pick up where you left off anytime, on as many movies as you want.

KG: ya, roku box is nice, I may pick up a few for other TVs in the house if/when netflix expands their library significantly.

DangerousDaze

01-02-2009, 09:43 AM

the reaspn i replaced the Ps3 with a sony bdp-350 was that the ps3 will not bitstream to allow my receiver to take advantage of the tech built into it for the Dolby hd and such....
I'm afraid you wasted your money. The PS3 does it for you and the only difference is that the indicator light on your reveiver doesn't light up. As of April the PS3 has been capable of decoding DTS-HD Master Audio for full 7.1 channel 96k/24 bit sound.

/edit - I'm looking into this in more detail. I could be wrong. Again. :p

KidCactus

01-02-2009, 10:10 AM

I'm afraid you wasted your money. The PS3 does it for you and the only difference is that the indicator light on your reveiver doesn't light up. As of April the PS3 has been capable of decoding DTS-HD Master Audio for full 7.1 channel 96k/24 bit sound.

/edit - I'm looking into this in more detail. I could be wrong. Again. :p
The PS3 decodes DTS-HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD internally, so bitstreaming those formats is not possible. You have to use linear PCM, which is why I just bought a new receiver (a Denon AVR-2809).

DangerousDaze

01-02-2009, 11:10 AM

The PS3 decodes DTS-HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD internally, so bitstreaming those formats is not possible. You have to use linear PCM, which is why I just bought a new receiver (a Denon AVR-2809).

Yeah, that sounds about right. Here's a great thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1017825) on the AVS forum about it. I was right but only insofar as you have a receiver capable of understanding LPCM signals. You still get the correct sound but you won't see the right indication of Dolby/DTS etc. on your receiver.

Tron

01-02-2009, 11:32 AM

Is anyone else completely underwhelmed by the experience of upgrading to this "superior" technology?

Nope....I'm still blown away every time I watch a movie.

Tron

01-02-2009, 11:35 AM

KidCactus

01-02-2009, 11:49 AM

Yeah, that sounds about right. Here's a great thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1017825) on the AVS forum about it. I was right but only insofar as you have a receiver capable of understanding LPCM signals. You still get the correct sound but you won't see the right indication of Dolby/DTS etc. on your receiver.
And you can't use optical cable, since it doesn't have enough bandwidth for multi-channel LPCM. This is the very reason I had to upgrade my receiver; the one I have at the moment only does audio pass through over HDMI (no audio is passed to the speakers, only to the connected TV), so I have to use optical for the audio from my PS3.

biosc1

01-02-2009, 12:00 PM

I love Blu-Ray. I loved HD-DVD more. Main difference is BD-Java sucks. I loaded up Batman: Dark Knight in my in-laws new Blu-Ray player on Christmas...then had to wait while it "loaded"...then wait while it "loaded some more"...

I hate having to make excuses for technology. There player wasn't even connected to the internet and it was definitely trying to load BD-Java from the looks of the icon on-screen.

I loved HD-DVD due to it's instant overlays...seems like BD always has some sort of delay.

I still love Blu-Ray, though, because I hate pixelation...it really irritates me...and I don't really ever watch the "extras" on the disc, so I only ever encounter BD-Java on startup...something I learned to disable.

ps...I use a PS3. I also live in Canada, so Netflix is not an option...along with any real online movie rentals other than the local cable box or 360 movie rentals.

cp#

01-02-2009, 12:11 PM

Sorry, but there is only one Bluray on the market worth owning. Sony makes it ;)

Norse

01-02-2009, 12:47 PM

The PS3 decodes DTS-HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD internally, so bitstreaming those formats is not possible. You have to use linear PCM, which is why I just bought a new receiver (a Denon AVR-2809).

Yeah, that's what I do with my AVR-1908, which isn't HD compatible, but with the LPCM it outputs the decoded signal from the PS3. I actually think the audio is more improved than the video from DVD->Blu-ray

MalReynolds

01-02-2009, 01:08 PM

PS3 i have no problems whatsoever

Best Blu-ray player on the market

KidCactus

01-02-2009, 01:12 PM

Yeah, that's what I do with my AVR-1908, which isn't HD compatible, but with the LPCM it outputs the decoded signal from the PS3. I actually think the audio is more improved than the video from DVD->Blu-ray
The 2809 decodes the HD audio formats, but I really don't have any use for it at the moment since I'm going LPCM anyway. But I chose that one anyway, due to the variety of inputs and to be a bit future safe if I'd need HD audio decoding later on.

Norse

01-02-2009, 01:12 PM

PS3 i have no problems whatsoever

Best Blu-ray player on the market

Among them at least. You need to buy a remote for it to be considered a good Blu-ray player IMHO. I only wish it used IR so I could use a universal remote.

Tron

01-02-2009, 01:23 PM

Among them at least. You need to buy a remote for it to be considered a good Blu-ray player IMHO. I only wish it used IR so I could use a universal remote.

In all honesty the absence of a remote hardly takes away from the PS3's brilliance as a BluRay player. That's the icing on the cake if you ask me.

DangerousDaze

01-02-2009, 01:29 PM

In all honesty the absence of a remote hardly takes away from the PS3's brilliance as a BluRay player. That's the icing on the cake if you ask me.

Plus, my controller works even when the dogs are in the way. Big furry buggers that they are! ;)

total

01-02-2009, 01:33 PM

Among them at least. You need to buy a remote for it to be considered a good Blu-ray player IMHO. I only wish it used IR so I could use a universal remote.

There are a couple different ways of making this happen if you have a learning remote (My Harmony 880 works with it).

biosc1

01-02-2009, 01:52 PM

There are a couple different ways of making this happen if you have a learning remote (My Harmony 880 works with it).

Right, but I'm assuming you have the IR dongle like I do?

A great idea is to get a USB extension cable, hide the PS3 in a ventilated cabinet and then string the IR dongle in a nice location. Reduces noise, but still gives full access to the device, as if it was bluetooth.

mesh

01-02-2009, 08:34 PM

I bought a pc bluray/hd-dvd reader and 2 test discs, 1 bluray (ironman) and 1 hddvd/dvd combo (appleseed).

I know it's not the same as a standalone player, and it seems it's quite a bit worse. The bundled powerdvd ultra failed to play ironman out of the box, appleseed worked fine. It automatically fetches an update that destroys the installation (detects/uses retail update which is different from drive bundled copy).

Once I reinstalled and manually got the correct update it did play ironman too. If an update is needed whenever a new title is released it gets old real fast, especially with a non-fonctionnal auto-update.

In any case, after playing both titles and seeing what little benefit the HD part is countered by the software crap you have to deal with. I'm sticking with DVDs.

Oh and I tried a regular dvd with the same powerdvd, it bluescreened, first time ever on this laptop I've used for over a year.

Siraris

01-02-2009, 08:40 PM

violent

01-02-2009, 08:40 PM

I use the PS3 as my player and my experience is as such: The Nine Inch Nails disc was the first I bought and I thought it looked fantastic. After that, I pretty much took it in as my standard format. It doesn't blow me away as it did the first time but then, what does? I think something like Blu-Ray needs to be delivered properly the first time someone experiences it and then the choice to move or not will be obvious.

Inspector Fowler

01-02-2009, 08:57 PM

I have the Samsung 2500 series. So far I enjoy it a lot - it does one thing that NO OTHER DVD PLAYER I HAVE OWNED does! It automatically corrects its own aspect ratio.

I know there are other players that do that, but I was always pissed that my PS3 and 360 did not. So, for example, before, I'd pop in a widescreen DVD, but the trailers are often in 4:3. If I don't want to watch the stretched out picture (which makes me NUTS), I have to manually set it to 4:3 and reset it when the widescreen feature comes on. The Samsung does it for me.

Tron

01-02-2009, 10:03 PM

Fubl

01-02-2009, 10:31 PM

theres a noticeable diffrence no matter what everyone says between letting my receiver do its job and letting the ps3. And its not just a stupid light. Alot of times it was only giving me a 5.1 feild or the 7.1 the rears where very weak since moving to the bdp-350 theres been a marked improvement. Remeber it all comes down to which hard ware you have and the pass throughs on the receiver. Also gives me a blu ray player in my bedroom now since thats all i really use the ps3 for....

Shjinta

01-02-2009, 11:23 PM

Stmfuller

01-03-2009, 12:41 AM

I have 2 players. A PS3 (which my wife uses when she wants to play Blu-ray but is also my primary gaming system), and a self built PC that hooks to my TV (which I play Left 4 Dead on too :) )
The reason my wife uses the PS3 is because the computer is a fuck-all problem to use (even though we didn't buy Sony's remote). This whole "media PC" thing turned out to not be as user friendly as I hoped it would be.
Here's the rundown:
PowerDVD Ultra 8 is the default best program (the other options are horrible resource hogs that just don't fucking work), has terrible support, and can't always play Blu-Rays out of the box (usually an update, but sometimes whatever this week's newest security protection on the blu-ray fucks up the playback). Iron Man was the last one of note (they've been playing better as of late, but AnyDVD HD is always on).
Couple that with HDCP garbage, you eventually give up and end up using AnyDVD HD (like another poster had mentioned) as an add-on to strip off the hdcp, the BD+ protection, and any ads. So, even though I have completely legally purchased the drive, playback software, have all the necessary hardware with more than enough resources I can still have movies come across my desk that won't play when I pop it into the drive unless I use legally questionable (and fucking expensive) software.
That being said, when Blu-Ray works..it fucking looks/sounds great.

HD-DVD IMO was the better format because the only problem I ever had on those were dirty discs not reading (a first generation problem with most disc-based media), but good guys can't always win. HD-DVD just worked, and that's what the huddled masses really need if the format is ever going to be pushed forward.

Karak

01-03-2009, 01:06 AM

I loved HD DVD, worked far better than Blu-ray outta da box. However, having cried over spilt milk I have a Samsung Blu-Ray and its awesome. I am not too impressed(does matter much to me) with Blu-ray but I have it for when everything switches to that if it does. The cost of the movies are still too high and I still buy 99.9% of my shtuff on normal dvd.

BlackPete

01-03-2009, 01:42 AM

The only thing that annoys me about Blu-Ray, is, when I watch on my PS3, and I fast forward, I cannot just hit X to start playing again. I have to bring up the menu and hit the play button.

Really, really stupid,.

Hmm... I must confess I've never ran into this on my PS3. Then again I don't usually watch Blu-ray movies, so I honestly can't remember if I've ever fast forwarded a Blu-ray movie.

Still I do watch DVDs pretty regularly on my PS3 and I was under the impression the PS3 uses the same interface for both DVD and Blu-ray. Oh well.

To the OP: Blu-ray is quite pretty on the 46" TV, but to be perfectly honest... the PS3 does a fine enough job of upscaling DVD movies that I really don't watch Blu-ray much. I like the HD pictures, but not enough to pay extra for it. I suppose that puts me straight in the middle as "whelmed".

muddi900

01-03-2009, 05:28 AM

powerDVD problems...

Have you tried corel WinDVD???

Stmfuller

01-03-2009, 07:13 AM

Have you tried corel WinDVD???
yes. and it had probably the best DVD upscaler I've ever seen...It's too bad that the Blu-ray part of it skipped like crazy and I could never get it to work right. WinDVD was RMA'd back to corel within 24 hours of me buying it.
Also, not giving a demo out to test blu-ray functionality?
bad form dudes.

BlackPete

01-04-2009, 09:31 PM

Stmfuller

01-04-2009, 10:03 PM

Well I picked up The Dark Knight on Blu-ray... and I experimented with it a bit. Sure enough I could fast forward, pause, rewind, etc. all at a button press. No need for a menu.

Which popular movie uses Java content?

warner movies automatically load the movie w/out a menu.
but all blu-rays use a form of java.

DangerousDaze

01-05-2009, 03:42 AM

warner movies automatically load the movie w/out a menu.
but all blu-rays use a form of java.

If it's non-intrusive like it is with The Dark Knight, so what?

Stmfuller

01-05-2009, 08:20 AM

If it's non-intrusive like it is with The Dark Knight, so what?

I wish I knew more about this, so take what I have to say fwiw.
It's my understanding that part of the security in the BD container is non-standardized...so it can create playback problems. Such as the the problems with Iron Man when it came out.