The End of Wall Street

[Goronmon]

http://www.portfolio.com/news-markets/national-news/portfolio/2008/11/11/The-End-of-Wall-Streets-Boom?tid=true

Thought this article was pretty well written and quite interesting given the current situation the economy is in.

Basically, it's ridiculous how crazy and broken the financial markets were.

[Crowe]

Definitely an interesting article.

It specialized in asking home­owners with bad credit and no proof of income to put no money down and defer interest payments for as long as possible. In Bakersfield, California, a Mexican strawberry picker with an income of $14,000 and no English was lent every penny he needed to buy a house for $720,000.

That's wrong.

[roboninja]

Luckily, the governement possibly bought that debt, so the bank lost no money for their horrendous stupidity and blatant disregard for prudence. Yay!

[Goronmon]

Yeah, just plain crazy.

There weren’t enough Americans with shitty credit taking out loans to satisfy investors’ appetite for the end product. The firms used Eisman’s bet [shorting the bonds] to synthesize more of them. Here, then, was the difference between fantasy finance and fantasy football: When a fantasy player drafts Peyton Manning, he doesn’t create a second Peyton Manning to inflate the league’s stats. But when Eisman bought a credit-default swap, he enabled Deutsche Bank to create another bond identical in every respect but one to the original. The only difference was that there was no actual homebuyer or borrower. The only assets backing the bonds were the side bets Eisman and others made with firms like Goldman Sachs. Eisman, in effect, was paying to Goldman the interest on a subprime mortgage. In fact, there was no mortgage at all.

[Purple Santa]

Business rebound. Wall St. will again find new ways to make money. Not tomorrow...but again the financial markets will be filled with stories of "evil rich men". Cycles. Just another cycle. I heard similar doom stories back in 1988 too.

[Goronmon]

I heard similar doom stories back in 1988 too.Did you read the article?

[Telefrog]

Have any of you read Liar's Poker, by the article's author? It's a great book and very funny in a laugh-or-you'll-cry way.

[Goronmon]

I haven't, but I want to after reading that article.

[Schnoogs]

There is no need to bring drama from another thread like this.

[PathMaster]

Andrew Jackson would smite Wall Street if he were around today.

[Generation ABXY]

Luckily, the governement possibly bought that debt, so the bank lost no money for their horrendous stupidity and blatant disregard for prudence. Yay!

Are we still doing that? I couldn't quite figure out what Paulson was going on about yesterday, apart from the whole, "Hey, let's do this since it has less taxpayer securities!" thing.

[Ox]

We are not doing that. Speculation abounds as to why we're not, but we're not. So speaketh the cranium.
http://msnbcmedia1.msn.com/j/ap/3085704b-703e-4b3a-b0ce-856e131e6c8b.hmedium.jpg

[civil]

There is no need to bring drama from another thread like this.
I gotta question whether or not Schnoogs is all looks and no brains (check him out in a suit - looks suave).

Somethin' about that boy just ain't right.

[Purple Santa]

Did you read the article?

I read the book. does that count?

[Generation ABXY]

We are not doing that. Speculation abounds as to why we're not, but we're not. So speaketh the cranium.
http://msnbcmedia1.msn.com/j/ap/3085704b-703e-4b3a-b0ce-856e131e6c8b.hmedium.jpg

The constant steepling of his fingers during the speech annoyed the piss out of me. I have no good reason for that, it just did.

[LongStepMantis]

Damn. Is Schnoogs trying to set a record for getting bans?

[TheFlyingOrc]

Damn. Is Schnoogs trying to set a record for getting bans?

Has anyone else even BEEN banned?

[Generation ABXY]

Has anyone else even BEEN banned?

Yeah, there was that Radiohead dude at one point.

[Grifter]

Damn. Is Schnoogs trying to set a record for getting bans?

No, he's just not smart enough to figure out why he keeps getting banned hence his obnoxious repetitiveness.

He's like one of those assholes who will go to a bar just to find the smallest weakest person there and start a fight with them to make himself feel better the problem in schnoogs case is he keeps going to the same bar, picking on the same people and gets his ass kicked every time.

I'm honestly hoping he'll just crawl back to EvAv after this and leave this site alone. I'm tired of the guy starting fights and ruining threads just because he can.


Some one should teach him not to shit where he eats.

Has anyone else even BEEN banned?

Yeah, the Lemon Party King (Radioguy) and Disgustipated have both been temp banned.

[Goronmon]

I read the book. does that count?Not towards reading the article, unfortunately. :p

[TheFlyingOrc]

No, he's just not smart enough to figure out why he keeps getting banned hence his obnoxious repetitiveness.

He's like one of those assholes who will go to a bar just to find the smallest weakest person there and start a fight with them to make himself feel better the problem in schnoogs case is he keeps going to the same bar, picking on the same people and gets his ass kicked every time.

I'm honestly hoping he'll just crawl back to EvAv after this and leave this site alone. I'm tired of the guy starting fights and ruining threads just because he can.

Some one should teach him not to shit where he eats.

Simply put, he's a troll. I troll to some extent on some occasions, but he just really gets off on making other people upset over the internet, and that's most of what he does. It's unfortunate, because he honestly seems to have some level of intelligence, he just uses it for evil.

Most of the time when Schnoogs acts like he didn't understand your argument and keeps rambling about what he was already rambling about, he actually understood what you were saying, he just wants to make you mad. It took me a while to realize this.

[Grifter]

Simply put, he's a troll. I troll to some extent on some occasions, but he just really gets off on making other people upset over the internet, and that's most of what he does. It's unfortunate, because he honestly seems to have some level of intelligence, he just uses it for evil.

Most of the time when Schnoogs acts like he didn't understand your argument and keeps rambling about what he was already rambling about, he actually understood what you were saying, he just wants to make you mad. It took me a while to realize this.


I know, which is why you won't see me involved in any of his asinine arguments. Personally I think it's stupid and juvenile and if he was as smart as he thinks he is he wouldn't need to start fights to get him self off. Especially on a forum he frequents as much as this one.

[LongStepMantis]

Simply put, he's a troll. I troll to some extent on some occasions, but he just really gets off on making other people upset over the internet, and that's most of what he does. It's unfortunate, because he honestly seems to have some level of intelligence, he just uses it for evil.

Most of the time when Schnoogs acts like he didn't understand your argument and keeps rambling about what he was already rambling about, he actually understood what you were saying, he just wants to make you mad. It took me a while to realize this.

He has been kind of predictable lately.

Enter thread, relate topic somehow to Obama being a communist, then dodge all questions while simultaneously insulting anyone who questions him.

He got under my skin a few times at EvAv, but I decided that leaving a thread once he goes into troll mode was always the best option. It's not like you're going to convince him he was wrong. I don't dislike him outright, I just wish he would just start being civil and stop treating people with valid arguments as if they were morons.

[Grifter]

He has been kind of predictable lately.

Enter thread, relate topic somehow to Obama being a communist

Funny, that's one of the few things I agreed with him on. :D

In all seriousness though. I just don't think this community needs people like schnoogs. We all give each other shit every once in a while and the occasional argument breaks out but it normally gets resolved or forgotten and rarely do you see anyone of us go into a thread with the sole intention of ruining it or maliciously insulting other users.

[Telefrog]

So what got deleted from Schnoog's post? Can anyone PM me about it if it's too upsetting?

[Grifter]

So what got deleted from Schnoog's post? Can anyone PM me about it if it's too upsetting?

I don't know, I missed it as well but I'm assuming it had something to do with the LCD panel price fixing thread.

[Telefrog]

I don't know, I missed it as well but I'm assuming it had something to do with the LCD panel price fixing thread.

Sweet. Hopefully, it was about me. :D

Edit: Just so everyone knows, I think it's actually pretty amusing watching Schnoogs fall into his own wordplay traps.

[Hellbug]

Ha, I love this part of the article here, just because it is so true.

When a Wall Street investment bank screwed up badly enough, its risks became the problem of the U.S. government. “It’s laissez-faire until you get in deep shit,”

Just trying to get the thread back on topic of the actual article, people :D

[MagGnome]

I'd like to know what Schnoogs got banned for as well. It must have been pretty bad, considering his rampant trolling in several other threads.

On topic - this article is really interesting. That's about all I've got for now. :p

[LordDon]

Ha, I love this part of the article here, just because it is so true.

Awesome quote, Hellbug. That government bailout has been absolutely awesome for buying up competition and throwing lavish retreats. Not so much for actually trying to correct some of the loans though.

Don't we own 80% of these guys now? Can't we vote their asses off the board?

[MagGnome]

This whole situation is, quite frankly, disgusting. Even more so because most of these fat cats will escape with a ton of cash and few (if any) consequences.

[Shrinn]

This whole situation is, quite frankly, disgusting. Even more so because most of these fat cats will escape with a ton of cash and few (if any) consequences.

I read somewhere over on PIRI that the reason this is still happening is that there are clauses in the company contracts (statutes.. whatever) that demand the large payouts. And the bailout/buy up happened without any clause forbidding these large escapes.

[J Arcane]

The moment Salomon Brothers demonstrated the potential gains to be had by the investment bank as public corporation, the psychological foundations of Wall Street shifted from trust to blind faith.
He agreed that the main effect of turning a partnership into a corporation was to transfer the financial risk to the shareholders. “When things go wrong, it’s their problem,” he said—and obviously not theirs alone. When a Wall Street investment bank screwed up badly enough, its risks became the problem of the U.S. government. “It’s laissez-faire until you get in deep shit,” he said, with a half chuckle. He was out of the game.

And this is the foundation our country is now built on. These are the people calling the real shots, the people in power.

How anyone can catch even a slight glimpse of the corporate world and not go mad with rage I will never understand.

Great article, Goronmon. It's fascinating, and vaguely comforting to know, that there's at least a few people in the thick of it who can actually see the abyss for what it is.

[MagGnome]

Unfortunately too many have bought the whole system hook, line, and sinker. These big companies have so much power now it's insane. It's unfortunate that they actually have more sway over our government than we do.

[Generation ABXY]

Unfortunately too many have bought the whole system hook, line, and sinker. These big companies have so much power now it's insane. It's unfortunate that they actually have more sway over our government than we do.

That’s what the Democrats get for supporting deregulation. ;)

[J Arcane]

That’s what the Democrats get for supporting deregulation. ;)
"The only thing worse than a Republican, or a Democrat, is when these two pricks work together." -- Lewis Black

;)

[Ancalagon]

I really hope Premier Obama can actually bring some of that change he's been talking about. We need stricter rules for lobbyists, and more regulation in the industry. This whole fiasco came about because of unregulated greed (by we, I mean you actually). My only worry is that Washington is too entrenched in its ways for Obama to be able to effect change. So we will have to wait and see.

As for Schnoogs.... I cant say I'm surprised, he seems to take pleasure out of being a douche. Personally I think any repeat offenders should get longer and longer bans until a perma ban. I mean, I think its good to not rely to heavily on moderation, but some people clearly cant learn what is acceptable and what isnt. They have no place here.

[Narradisall]

The trick is to make your failure so huge that it threatens the whole system.

Interesting article, I doubt you will see the end of this stuff though. They'll just find new ways to abuse the system.

#Edit: Didn't Schnoogs get banned once already?

[Telefrog]

Unfortunately too many have bought the whole system hook, line, and sinker. These big companies have so much power now it's insane. It's unfortunate that they actually have more sway over our government than we do.

It's greed, pure and simple. Not of the corporations. (Heck, they're just doing what they were designed to do - make money any legal way possible.) The real root of the issue is that individual people get into the business and stay despite not really knowing what they're doing other than making wads of money. The system is basically a magic money machine to them and they only know that cranking it makes them richer. They can't really explain how it works or the consequences of it working.

Now we're seeing that final payday for that hubris.

[Felonous]

I'm so glad they banned Snoogs, we don't need his kind of asshattery here. Over the many years at EvAv, Snoogs was the only user that I ever had to put on Ignore. Which is sad considering some of the posters that were frequent at EvAv.

Once again, thank you moderators for cleaning house. When a dog poops inside, you have to kick em out into the cold.

[Blue]

How did Schnoogs get banned again? Jeez son.