Dead Space... turn of v-sync.

[Hotcod]

off even

The mouse drag issues are being caused by v-sync with it off the mouse works fine... i've also had my load time cut by 95%... i wish i was kidding about that but i'm really not. It dose make the game a tad more jerky in places but dear god the faster load times and an none stupid mouse are worth putting up with it for

[Young Al Capone]

Always turn off vsync, that shit only serves to slow things down and fuck shit up.

In fact, that was the original design, but investors were worried that nobody would be interested so they made up that bullshit about refresh rates and screen tearing.

[Hotcod]

ya i always always turn it off which is why i was surprised that i didn't do it for dead space... i was talking about the mouse issue on another forum and some one said to turn off vsync as it was stupidly bad in dead space even for vsync. And given that a few people where have talked about the floating mouse issue i thought i might as well say something

[biosc1]

Here's my thing with V-Sync...okay, so it's supposed to prevent screen tearing...well, if my pc is acting poorly enough to cause screen tearing, then it will not be powerful enough to handle V-Sync.

[LongStepMantis]

Don't most video drivers include an option to permanently disable V-sync?
Blocking it at the driver level means you never have to mess with disabling it for individual titles again...it simply won't be able to run. I've yet to encounter any title that wouldn't run without it enabled.

[Young Al Capone]

Here's my thing with V-Sync...okay, so it's supposed to prevent screen tearing...well, if my pc is acting poorly enough to cause screen tearing, then it will not be powerful enough to handle V-Sync.

I am not 100%, but I think it has something to do with CRT -vs- LCD and old graphics hardware being designed for CRT.

[Chill]

Always turn off vsync, that shit only serves to slow things down and fuck shit up.

In fact, that was the original design, but investors were worried that nobody would be interested so they made up that bullshit about refresh rates and screen tearing.

Isn't that what triple buffering is for? All I know is that my display tears like fucking crazy if I have v-sync disabled. Maybe its my type of display (AS-IPS panel) or I'm very sensitive to that effect, but vsync solves it and triple buffering keeps my FPS up.

On-topic EDIT: Glad I didn't buy Dead Space yet, as I hope they can solve these problems before I do.

[Zrikz]

So after seeing this thread, I turned off V-sync.. much better game play and omg quick load times. wtf does it even do? Because I went from 30 fps to 90-110 fps.

[LiquidRain]

I always run my games with triple buffering + vsync. The only reason I can think of why triple buffering is not standard is because it adds a 1 frame delay to the mouse movement, which might frustrate some really hardcore people?

I can't really tell. Most LCD monitors have an input lag, anywhere from 6ms (1/3rd a frame at 60fps) for the best to 25ms (~1.5 frames at 60fps) for bad ones. I know I don't really care about 16ms in a single player game so I always turn on triple buffer + vsync. It has none, if any, harm to performance, and I get to avoid screen tearing. And I hate screen tearing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_buffering

[KingGorilla]

I remember this with Bioshock. I know Vsync is intended to keep my screen from tearing, but it must just be a dog shit mode.

[Deadend]

V-synch is only supposed to be used when your framerate is TOO high and you want to cap it at 60. If you are running at less than 60FPS or less than 30.. it is horrible for you.

[RandoM51]

V-synch is only supposed to be used when your framerate is TOO high and you want to cap it at 60. If you are running at less than 60FPS or less than 30.. it is horrible for you.

Wrong. Utterly and entirely wrong.

v-sync has one purpose and that is to match the software framerate with whatever your monitor is capable of producing, thus removing "tearing".

In relatively recent times v-sync has become an issue due to the rise of LCD displays where the refresh rate is less than we enjoyed on CRT displays.

On a CRT display you'd usually have a refresh rate that the game could not itself match,thus removing any possibility of tearing. Not true on LCD.

...and here is the grand wisdom: If you have a CRT, you do not need v-sync. If you have an LCD you might need vsync, and if you DO need it, enable triple-buffering if possible to ameliorate the performance hit.

:)

I don't mean this as a slight, Deadend, we seem to agree quite frequently on any number of matters, perhaps to your chagrin. Thing is, the things I agree with everybody on? I don't see any point in making a me-too post about. :)

[Zrikz]

What exactly is this "screen tearing"? I think I have a 2ms LCD, duno if I've ever seen it. I'm too lazy to wiki it, so you don't really have to answer this... I will eventually wake up.

[Ancalagon]

Wrong. Utterly and entirely wrong.

v-sync has one purpose and that is to match the software framerate with whatever your monitor is capable of producing, thus removing "tearing".

In relatively recent times v-sync has become an issue due to the rise of LCD displays where the refresh rate is less than we enjoyed on CRT displays.

On a CRT display you'd usually have a refresh rate that the game could not itself match,thus removing any possibility of tearing. Not true on LCD.

...and here is the grand wisdom: If you have a CRT, you do not need v-sync. If you have an LCD you might need vsync, and if you DO need it, enable triple-buffering if possible to ameliorate the performance hit.

:)

I don't mean this as a slight, Deadend, we seem to agree quite frequently on any number of matters, perhaps to your chagrin. Thing is, the things I agree with everybody on? I don't see any point in making a me-too post about. :)

As far as I understand it, the only reason you would never need v sync is either if your framerate is exactly equal to your refresh rate, or if your refresh rate is high enough for you to not notice tearing (ie the differences between successive frames will be pretty small).

[Deadend]

Wrong. Utterly and entirely wrong.

v-sync has one purpose and that is to match the software framerate with whatever your monitor is capable of producing, thus removing "tearing".



I thought bad shit happens if you have v-syc on and your framerate is lower than refresh rate? Or at least I remember games having no tearing... but dear god the framerate was noticeably worse.

I have only tried the Orange Box with V-sync on and it did prevent screen tearing when I decided to do quick 180s, but I'd rather not use. Tearing is just dandy with me... means I am too awesome for my monitor to keep up with :)

But we do mostly agree.

[LiquidRain]

Random, you've got a lot wrong. V-Sync makes a difference on any monitor. Whether your framerate is above or below your monitor's refresh rate doesn't matter.

It's about the push of the render (front) buffer onto your monitor being synchronized to the start your monitor's vertical refresh. (for those who don't know: traditional CRT monitors render each pixel top to bottom, left to right sequentially. really really fast. when the CRT reaches the very end, it sends a vertical blank signal [or if you prefer, vertical synchronization, thus v-sync] back to the PC. LCDs inherited the same signal processing)

Tearing can happen at any framerate if the graphics card renders the buffer to screen in the middle of a monitor's vertical refresh. V-Sync times the buffer-to-screen render precisely when the monitor starts its vertical refresh, so that an entire unbroken frame is rendered to screen.

The problem most people see with v-sync killing their framerate and causing delays is with the default behaviour of having a double buffer. Games render using two internal graphics buffers: the back buffer is being drawn on by the game, while the front buffer is being displayed to the monitor. When the back buffer is complete, the two of them "switch sides." This can cause a problem with v-sync when your framerate slows down. The reason is simple: the rendering frame misses the vertical synchronization mark. It has to wait for the next v-sync to render that frame - meaning on a 60Hz display, you'll get 30fps, since it can only actually present its front buffer at 1/2 of 60Hz.

Turning off v-sync would just have the graphics card present tLook at this. (http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1049569&page=1&pp=20&highlight=244t+3007) he front buffer to you in the middle of a screen refresh. And that's why you see tearing.

Triple buffering solves this issue by simply adding another front buffer to the mix, so that there's always a fully rendered buffer that's waiting for v-sync. This way a v-sync is never missed, and you get something very close (you may lose 1-3fps) to what your non-vsync framerate would be while always rendering a full, solid frame to the monitor with no tearing. The disadvantage to this is that you are introducing a delay of having to render another frame ahead of what the monitor displays. At solid 60fps, this is 16ms, which to me is an undetectable difference.

Some people may argue that's huge, in which case, I challenge you to take a camera that can take fast exposures and clone your LCD to a CRT monitor and run a input delay test program. Compare a snapshot of both monitors. The LCD will be behind the CRT in displaying an image. Lots of LCD monitors have signal processing delays of over 25ms compared to CRTs. HDTVs just add filters that make it worse, but the delay is inherent to LCDs. The very fastest LCD input delays are in the 7ms range compared to CRTs. You just never knew. Take a look at this slow-mo video of someone playing Quake 3. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pi2OE6hSh00) Surprise! Remember: an input lag of just 16ms is one whole frame at 60fps! :)

Here's an even longer post on the subject: http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=928593

You have all been educated now. Stop getting it wrong. :|

(for the record, I run on a display with an approx 25ms input lag and use triple buffering. I don't notice or care about the lag. I like my screen tearing to be non-existent at any frame rate on single player games.)