F.U.D.Cast Season 2, Episode 4: WWGFD? (Half-Life 2)

[Mot Wakorb]

http://www.gameradio.us/pics/fudcastcog.jpg

Episode 4 comes to you care of the Vortigaunts, as we explore City 17 in Valve's Half-Life 2. What's considered by many to be the pinnacle of FPS games (even now by some standards), Gordon Freeman gets thrown into a mix of trouble once again as the G-Man decides it's time to put his hired gun into action. Even now, the FUDCast Crew has trouble finding flaws with this classic, other than the fact that Valve seems to want to take their sweet time delivering the third episode of their continued series. When we do find fault, we come to a bit of a roadblock as lines are drawn - the "spoon fed" storyline fans and the "search for it" storyline fans. In the end - the game still blows us away with what it can do graphically, and we're still having fun to this day (well, except for the vehicles.)

Want to be on the show? Check out the thread! (http://www.colonyofgamers.com/cogforums/showthread.php?t=15809)

Have a suggestion for a game for us to play? Let us know! (http://www.colonyofgamers.com/cogforums/showthread.php?t=15807)

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[violent]

Half Life 2 is better than Half Life you.

[TrackZero]

Also, Shodan is dang good on this one.

[nabokovfan87]

Yay I can finally listen to the Fudcast.

Maybe you all would like to do this as an email for the next show, but suppose you are someone from the outside looking in at the half-life games.

You see a game add physics based puzzles, which was unheard of, story, which was unheard of, and what amounts to the single most influential way of telling a story. How many games, nowadays, do you sit in a cutscene and listen to the story break down, fallout 3 did it, america's army did it, and I'm going to guess a hell of a lot of others did so.

Half-life was good because it created how to tell a story. It's pacing, and the way it told you the story was what made it a big deal.

This is from wiki:

Half-Life was critically acclaimed, earning an overall score of 96% on review collection website Metacritic.[60] Computer Gaming World's Jeff Green said that the game "is not just one of the best games of the year. It's one of the best games of any year, an instant classic that is miles better than any of its immediate competition, and - in its single-player form - is the best shooter since the original Doom"

The immersive gaming experience and interactive environment was cited by several reviewers as being revolutionary.[68] Allgame said "It isn't everyday that you come across a game that totally revolutionizes an entire genre, but Half-Life has done just that.

Guinness World Records awarded Half-Life with the world record for "Best-Selling First-Person Shooter of All Time (PC)" in the Guinness World Records: Gamer's Edition 2008.

Now lets look at hl2, added the gravity gun, which, took what hl2 did with puzzles and turned it on its head. Kind of replaced hit E to "use" (pickup things) with an actual gun, but the real innovation was STEAM itself, animation tech and emotion gameplay, and maybe just stepping everything up. Sounded better, felt better, but all in all it was more half-life, which was fucking perfect. Keep in mind though, this is a huge leap in tech between the two games.

Coincidently, on wikipedia, there is no "legacy" section for hl2.

Perhaps, when Black Mesa is released, you all should take a look back at half life, maybe then you will understand what the big deal is.

GOTY awards:
HL: 50+
HL2: 40+

[shodan2020]

Secret Best FUDcast ever. :)

[shodan2020]

GOTY awards:
HL: 50+
HL2: 40+

So, the fact that Valve created an entirely new game engine and gave you a deep and involving storyline with groundbreaking character models and top-notch voice acting means nothing to you?

I'm not saying that the original Half-Life sucked or anything, it is an amazing game in it's own right, and we wouldn't have had HL2 without it, but HL2 is incredible for what it is. Listen to the podcast. :)

[Ghostbear]

*stuff*
Really guy? Look HL1 is amazing, to insinuate that we don't "get it" is insulting. HL2 is a better game IMO game of the year award numbers not withstanding.

[Mot Wakorb]

See, I understand that HL was really what begot what we played, but just because wiki entries and reviews are saying amazing things doesn't mean it invalidates our choices, especially that a lot of us liked HL2 more than the original. It was a better game in every way - it doesn't suddenly invalidate the first game, it just means we liked it more.

[UWCrash]

Really guy? Look HL1 is amazing, to insinuate that we don't "get it" is insulting. HL2 is a better game IMO game of the year award numbers not withstanding.

Uh-oh, someone told Jeremy he was wrong! Everyone to battlestations, we're on RED ALERT*.

*We don't have any plans to do a Red Alert game at this time.

[nabokovfan87]

So, the fact that Valve created an entirely new game engine and gave you a deep and involving storyline with groundbreaking character models and top-notch voice acting means nothing to you?

I'm not saying that the original Half-Life sucked or anything, it is an amazing game in it's own right, and we wouldn't have had HL2 without it, but HL2 is incredible for what it is. Listen to the podcast. :)

Lol, shodan, back in the day, what hl did was ground braking [enter stuff you said about hl2]. Not character models per say or graphics, but come on, what other games had a story like that. That is what my point it. And like i said, if you take the graphics and such out of the way, black mesa, then you will have a whole new comparison brought about because you will see what hl1 did again instead of just off memory.

I like hl2, I really do, but it is nowhere near half-life for me.

See, I understand that HL was really what begot what we played, but just because wiki entries and reviews are saying amazing things doesn't mean it invalidates our choices, especially that a lot of us liked HL2 more than the original. It was a better game in every way - it doesn't suddenly invalidate the first game, it just means we liked it more.

But you are talking about it after having played half-life 2 in a time where hl2 is the new hotness and not half life. Think if you had recorded a fudcast months prior to hl2 coming out, and compare that to what you said about hl2, that's what I want to hear.

Remember back, the lightning room where you had to jump from table to table, the first game that I can remember where you had to crouch jump, stacking boxes on the end of a plank to get it to weigh down and allow you to get across the jump on the other end, the stacking of boxes to get into the ceiling on the 2nd floor, the hydra jump where you had to use the boostpack, the fricking hydra battle! come on guys.... remember when....

[Ghostbear]

Uh-oh, someone told Jeremy he was wrong! Everyone to battlestations, we're on RED ALERT*.

*We don't have any plans to do a Red Alert game at this time.

Heh, not so much being told I'm wrong as being told I'm stupid.

[violent]

I'm stupid. But I'm stupid only because I'm bored.

[nabokovfan87]

Heh, not so much being told I'm wrong as being told I'm stupid.

Hey man,

Apologies if you took what I said as offensive in any way. I intended for what I said to be discussion and not a "your clearly wrong" mentality. A lot of looking back exercises can come into how things came about for the two sides, you might have a deep appreciation for half-life 2, but I might have the same appreciation for the first one. It comes down to our specific tastes, likes, and experiences.

[Ghostbear]

You're under the weird impression that I don't love Half Life 1. That is far from the case.

[nabokovfan87]

I didn't say anyone didn't love, hated, or did not enjoy half-life. Just that it is difficult to remember that time because it was so far long ago.

[violent]

I think i broke my toe today.

[nabokovfan87]

I'm sure there is a story that goes along with that.

[TrackZero]

Lol, shodan, back in the day, what hl did was ground braking [enter stuff you said about hl2]. Not character models per say or graphics, but come on, what other games had a story like that.

I thought we covered this in a show at one point. I'd say both games were breakthroughs in many ways. I had argued though that the lessons from the first Half-Life were not picked up by their contemporary titles back in the day (I had cited specific examples). While Half-Life 2 definitely led to more industry adoption (for whatever reason). Though many of the first games "new" ideas, I wouldn't exactly call rocket science, it was largely about scripted sequences and adding in physics puzzles. Things that, honestly, another developer would have done as a natural evolution to the genre (or attempted to at the time, but failed). While Half-Life 2 branched on on it's own, developing far deeper character interaction, pacing and passive narrative elements that other games have certainly adopted since that time. Or something like that, I'm tired so my brain is not running on all cylinders right now. My point being, with HL1 you really have to be careful not to wear the proverbial rose coloured lenses. While it was breakthrough, I think a large portion of it's "uber" success came down to the theme, genre and style of the time, more than specific gameplay advances.

[nabokovfan87]

My point being, with HL1 you really have to be careful not to wear the proverbial rose coloured lenses. While it was breakthrough, I think a large portion of it's "uber" success came down to the theme, genre and style of the time, more than specific gameplay advances.

Maybe hl2 "led to more industry adoption" was simply the time and the place. The first was a time when you would go to a store pay money for thing and take thing home and install it on PC. The second at a time when that is completely impossible to do outside of wal-mart, best buy, and a select few others, but had the extreme advantage of actual high speed internet and not dial up.

As far as you last sentence, you mention the success of the first was because of the time it was released rather then the gameplay. What about if HL never existed and we were all playing doom 5 instead. Just deathmatch, no css, dods, steam, or anything... Would that make you rethink your position?

[TrackZero]

Maybe hl2 "led to more industry adoption" was simply the time and the place. The first was a time when you would go to a store pay money for thing and take thing home and install it on PC. The second at a time when that is completely impossible to do outside of wal-mart, best buy, and a select few others, but had the extreme advantage of actual high speed internet and not dial up.

Actually, from 2004-2008 HL2s majority of sales were boxed copies. The steam copies only surpassed boxed in 2008.

http://i43.tinypic.com/14wystv.jpg

As far as you last sentence, you mention the success of the first was because of the time it was released rather then the gameplay. What about if HL never existed and we were all playing doom 5 instead. Just deathmatch, no css, dods, steam, or anything... Would that make you rethink your position?

That wouldn't happen. My point was, if HL1 never existed, another game would have sprung up that did similar things.

[nabokovfan87]

Actually, from 2004-2008 HL2s majority of sales were boxed copies. The steam copies only surpassed boxed in 2008.

http://i43.tinypic.com/14wystv.jpg



That wouldn't happen. My point was, if HL1 never existed, another game would have sprung up that did similar things.

Lol, I just had one of those bill nye the science guy "and now you know" moments.

Granted you bought it on disc, but you had to install and register it with steam, at least my boxed copy did. same thing with anything from valve that came out after that. You can go out and buy orange box in the store for pc, but it is essentially a boxed code with a useless disk.

Do you honestly know what other game would have done it? Perhaps somehthing like F.E.A.R. has a chance, max payne for sure, but that isn't fps. Tough to say, kind of like saying something along the lines of imagine the world without email or something like that, it is just hard to do.

[nabokovfan87]

Gave the show a 2nd listen to see if I missed anything, perhaps we can move onto this:

On the topic of games that came close to or did it as good as half-life 2, how about F.E.A.R.?

Also, what about Mods for the source engine that took half-life and turned it on its head, zombie master might not be the most fleshed out game, but it does do story well for a multiplayer only scenario?

And I will back up The Darkness, great game and even better story, sitting, trapped, watching her die was one of the most crazy scenes ever. Then, later on, when Un dies, I had to stop the game and process it.

[violent]

As the guy who brought up the question I may be seen as biased but, F.E.A.R as good as it was, was no Half Life 2. Without question.

[nabokovfan87]

As the guy who brought up the question I may be seen as biased but, F.E.A.R as good as it was, was no Half Life 2. Without question.

No, but it did some of the things that half-life 2 did, story, A.I., etc. You all were talking about that as well, may be what I was thinking of.

[jpc_theoneandonly]

Just wanted to say you guys are great. Love the show. I didn't start listening until about 6-7 episodes ago, but I have been hooked ever since.

[Jackel]

Just wanted to say you guys are great. Love the show. I didn't start listening until about 6-7 episodes ago, but I have been hooked ever since.

kind of like not feeding the trolls, you should learn not to feed Ghostbear's Ego.

[Mot Wakorb]

Hey jpc - thanks man, we appreciate it!

[shodan2020]

Lol, shodan, back in the day, what hl did was ground braking [enter stuff you said about hl2]. Not character models per say or graphics, but come on, what other games had a story like that. That is what my point it. And like i said, if you take the graphics and such out of the way, black mesa, then you will have a whole new comparison brought about because you will see what hl1 did again instead of just off memory.

I like hl2, I really do, but it is nowhere near half-life for me.


Lol, it's called a difference of opinion. We aren't robots that all have the same thoughts. You can tell me about all the GOTY and critic stuff you want. It's all opinion. I respect that, but I don't have to agree with it, and i'm not even disagreeing to the extent that you think I (or we on that particular podcast) are. It's great that you like Half-Life more than Half-Life 2. I cannot count the times my friends and I LANned that shit up for deathmatch, nor the countless times in college I spent wasting hours on TFC instead of studying. Our opinions on the cast are just as valid as yours.

[shodan2020]

Just wanted to say you guys are great. Love the show. I didn't start listening until about 6-7 episodes ago, but I have been hooked ever since.

The Earthbound and Silent Hill 2 ones are a few of my favorites.

I still love Earthbound... but I also have a Nintendo player's guide to back it up. What really sucks about Earthbound is that you'll need one of those or a FAQ to make it through to the end. If it was a better game, you wouldn't need one, even now. If that were the case, maybe the podcast would have been filled with talk of the final battle with Giygas, Pokey and the unique epilogue and credit roll. Even though they didn't like it, I still love the cast. It's hilarious.

"Paula prayed with her whole heart."

[nabokovfan87]

Lol, it's called a difference of opinion. We aren't robots that all have the same thoughts. You can tell me about all the GOTY and critic stuff you want. It's all opinion. I respect that, but I don't have to agree with it, and i'm not even disagreeing to the extent that you think I (or we on that particular podcast) are.

I hear ya man, and honestly I think I'm thinking something different then I'm saying or it is getting read wrong or what not, but whatever. Do me a favor, whenever you guys do a black mesa/hl:source/hl episode, send me an email/pm.

I don't know if you posted this because I pm'd someone on steam, but I meant it jokingly.