The Graphic Novel and Comic Thread

[Urizen]

It would be great if we had a thread where such recommendations, commentary and feedback could be aggregated.

For my immediate purposes, I'd like to get into The Outsiders. Apparently, there have already been three iterations of the storyline. Is any one of them the definitive one? Is there a specific writer I should look for? A specific arc or collection?

Thanks in advance.

[zarathstra]

With Outsiders, I would start with the Showcase volume currently available. Its 552 pages of Outsiders goodness for about 13 bucks on Amazon. Search under the full title "Batman and the Outsiders" to find it. Personally, its my favorite era, written by Mike W. Barr.

[Urizen]

...and ordered.

Grabbed a collection called 'Outsiders: Five of a Kind' as well because of positive reviews.

[Squidbot]

I highly recommend the collection of Alan Moore's work on Future Shocks (http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Future-Shocks-Alan-Moore/dp/190426588X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272203527&sr=8-1), from back when he was an "unkown" British writer. Stuff I grew up with, and really still awesome.

[Ink Asylum]

Scott Pilgrim. Read it before the movie releases.

[Clark]

The Walking Dead is fantastic. While the story takes place in a zombie-infested world, the zombies themselves are mostly part of the background. Or like a rising flood.

The true story is about how individuals react to a dark, new world and each other.

[muddi900]

I'll throw a shout out to Area 10, new book Vertigo Crime, by Christos Gage and the amazing Chris Samnee. Speaking of Christos Gage, he co-wrote probably the best GI Joe comic ever; GI Joe: Cobra. No, I have interest in the franchise otherwise.

[zarathstra]

As for general recommendations, I would throw out Invincible. It is currently the best solo superhero book out there.

Marvel:

Nova and Guardians of the Galaxy: Both books are pure sci-fi outer space fun
Thor: JMS's run was frankly amazing, grab it!
Immortal Iron Fist: Sadly canceled, but it is traded and well worth your time

DC:

Booster Gold: Hilarious time travel antics, with a sarcastic robot!
The Sinestro Corps War: A good primer if you plan to get into Blackest Night, but also a damned good story in its own right.

As for none superhero stuff, I'd go with Sandman, Transmetropolitan, Fables, Walking Dead...the list goes on and on, really. Also, if you like sarcastic robots (and who doesn't?) Atomic Robo is a good pick. Time travel, Lovecraftian monsters, Nazis, retro technology, Carl Sagan. The book has it all.

On the same theme, Tom Strong, written by Alan Moore, is a great book, like a combination of old pulp heroes and sci-fi movie serials. The whole series is out in trade, but they're in the process of re-releasing it in deluxe hardcover, which is how I'm picking it up. Two volumes released do far. Moore's other work in the same universe (Top 10, Promethea, a few others) are also a ton of fun if you have the money.

[Destro]

I agree with the above about Booster Gold and Sinestro (although i found the third Booster Gold trade to be subpar in storytelling). Green Lantern Rebirth is also a good read (especially if you're planning on reading the Sinestro Corps stuff), Identity Crisis, the early 2000s Geoff Johns Flash is great.

Chew and Y: The last man are great also, and i've become a fan of the Umbrella Academy as well as the Walking Dead.

If you want Batman stuff, the first Batman and Robin trade is out, and it is a great read.


Edit: Also, if you like Star Wars, the Legacy comics are good. No prior knowledge really required (other than maybe the movies)

[Squidbot]

I need to read some more Tom Strong, I believe. The little I did read didn't impress me much.

[muddi900]

If you want something totally unique, try Daytripper, from Fabio Moon and Gabriel Ba. The Brazilian wonder twins are brilliant.

[Urizen]

Scott Pilgrim. Read it before the movie releases.

Funny enough, I was really unimpressed by Vols. 1 and 2. And still underwhelmed by Vol. 3. But obviously, they are quick reads so I went through them all. I don't think they came into their own until fairly late in the series. I hardly got a laugh out of it...and fully expect the movie to blow the books out of the water.

Like I said, it's a quick read, so it's not much of an investment. But I would not give it a wholehearted recommendation.

I am going to pick up the deluxe releases of Fables as they come out. Sandman and Y: The Last Man are on my wish list.

Any opinions on the Fables and Sandman spin-offs?

[muddi900]

Jack of fables would be great up to the the third trade(?). I've been meaning to check out Lucifer, ever since I read Mike Carey and Peter Gross' current comic, The Unwritten. Some say its better than Sandman.

Speaking of the Unwritten, I am loving it. Its like Fables, only smarter.

[Hemalin]

...and ordered.

Grabbed a collection called 'Outsiders: Five of a Kind' as well because of positive reviews.
Five of a Kind bridges the previous series (Nightwing/Arsenal team) with the current run of Outsiders. If you're interested in the current run, it's a good place to start.

[Superman's Dead]

Jack of fables would be great up to the the third trade(?). I've been meaning to check out Lucifer, ever since I read Mike Carey and Peter Gross' current comic, The Unwritten. Some say its better than Sandman.


It's definitely different. I read a lot of Lucifer before I went back and read Sandman, and I was a little...put-off. Lucifer definitely has a great plot, and a main character that's just as compelling as Dream but a bit more approachable.

[Urizen]

Speaking of the Unwritten, I am loving it. Its like Fables, only smarter.

Fables is fun, but smart it is not. Not yet, anyway. There's still a million stories that can be told in that universe. I might have to look into The Unwritten, even though the synopsis didn't grab me.

Any thoughts on Preacher? Is it true the TPBs are better than the hardcover collector's release?

[Laughing Penguin]

I definitely appreciate some of the recommendations in this thread, as i'm now getting into the habit of scanning around for new stroylines to feature on the podcast.

[ shameless plug ]
http://thecomicsarchive.com/
[ / shameless plug ]

We actually covered a few of the suggestions in this thread (Atomic Robo just went up last week, for example), but I'm not nearly as familiar with some of the current superhero stuff as the others in this thread, so keep them coming!

As for some of my own recommendations, here's a few oldies but goodies I haven't seen mentioned yet:

Grendel by Matt Wagner (the War Child and Black, White and Red books are favorites of mine)
Mage Vol 1, also Matt Wagner, not as big a fan of the follow-up series tho
There's a new Marshall Law collection coming out soon - not a typical book by any means, but very cool IMHO. By Pat Mills and Denny O'Neil
The earlier Kabuki collections from David Mack
The Tick from Ben Edlund - should require no explanation
Scud: The Disposeable Assasin by Rob Schraab - just came out with a book collecting the whole series in one volume, great stuff
Hellboy by Mike Mignola - pretty much all of them

[muddi900]

Fables is fun, but smart it is not. Not yet, anyway. There's still a million stories that can be told in that universe. I might have to look into The Unwritten, even though the synopsis didn't grab me.

Any thoughts on Preacher? Is it true the TPBs are better than the hardcover collector's release?

Now that I think about it, the comparative degree was unnecessary. There are some nuanced aspects to Fables for English Lit majors, or so I have been told. As for the Unwritten, you can download the first issue free on the Vertigo web site:
http://www.dccomics.com/vertigo/graphic_novels/?gn=13677

This is true of all Vertigo and Wildstorm books that have had at least one trade out. Which excludes Daytripper at the moment.

[Urizen]

It's definitely different. I read a lot of Lucifer before I went back and read Sandman, and I was a little...put-off.

Sir, you don't exactly say why you were "put off". Disappointed in Sandman, or Lucifer...or is it something else?

Now that I think about it, the comparative degree was unnecessary. There are some nuanced aspects to Fables for English Lit majors, or so I have been told.

Thanks for the link. I am/was an English Major myself, and I do think I get an extra kick out of some panels or certain characterizations, but it's hardly got the polish of genius. Willingham doesn't go all the way. There are just too many empty and flat fable characters in his stories.

If you're interested in real critical commentary on fairy tales, I would recommend Jin-Roh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jin-Roh:_The_Wolf_Brigade), and Robert Darnton's The Great Cat Massacre (http://www.amazon.com/Great-Cat-Massacre-Episodes-Cultural/dp/0465012744/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272233429&sr=8-1). Two pieces of brilliance.

[LordDon]

I find myself looking outside the mainstream lately when it comes to comics. Like indie music, only with comics.

I picked up the first (http://www.amazon.com/Platinum-Grit-1-Trudy-Cooper/dp/1607060787/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272235584&sr=8-1) Platinum Grit (http://www.platinumgrit.com/) volume and loved it. Think Douglas Adams or Red Dwarf. Done by the same artist that creates Oglaf (http://www.oglaf.com/).

I'm totally sucked into the Gunnerkrigg Court (http://www.gunnerkrigg.com/index2.php) series as well, thanks to the webcomics thread. I picked up the first volume (http://www.amazon.com/Gunnerkrigg-Court-Vol-2-Orientation/dp/1932386343/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272235897&sr=8-2) and as soon as I finished it I immediately ordered the second (http://www.amazon.com/Gunnerkrigg-Court-Vol-2-Research/dp/1932386777/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272235897&sr=8-1). It's vaguely reminiscent of Harry Potter but with it's own original and deep mythos. Machine versus nature and the balance between them.

I recently discovered Brian Clevinger's (http://www.nuklearpower.com/8-bit-theater/) Atomic Robo (http://www.atomic-robo.com/) which is awesome pulp action and I'm sure I'll pick up all the trades in no time.

I also found Hexed (http://www.boom-studios.net/hexed-hc.html) up on Myspace of all places, which is sort of Buffy-esque but darker.

[Pigeon]

I don't get a lot of graphic novels, most of what I'm interested in I buy as they come out but there's a few I recommend:
100 Bullets (http://www.amazon.com/100-Bullets-Vol-First-Shot/dp/1563896451/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272237079&sr=1-1)
Wonderful Wizard of Oz (Marvel) (http://www.amazon.com/Wonderful-Wizard-Oz-Graphic-Novel/dp/0785129227/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272236961&sr=8-2)
Watchmen (http://www.amazon.com/Watchmen-Alan-Moore/dp/1401219268/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272237000&sr=1-1) (Should go without saying, but just in case)
The Tick (http://www.amazon.com/TICK-Complete-Edlund/dp/B001MUJ8VE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272237033&sr=1-1)(Which manages to be way better than the cartoon)

[Superman's Dead]

Sir, you don't exactly say why you were "put off". Disappointed in Sandman, or Lucifer...or is it something else?


Oh, I'm sorry. I wasn't disappointed in Sandman, exactly, but the over-arching story isn't exactly that...cohesive. Lucifer has a plot. You know what's happening, you know what has to happen, there's some sense of pace and drive. With Sandman...you stop every once in a while for some stories about some stuff. And it's great, don't get me wrong, but I really appreciated the flow of Lucifer.

[Krispy]

Fables is fun, but smart it is not. Not yet, anyway. There's still a million stories that can be told in that universe. I might have to look into The Unwritten, even though the synopsis didn't grab me.

Any thoughts on Preacher? Is it true the TPBs are better than the hardcover collector's release?

Can't comment on TPB's vs hardcover, but I absolutely loved the series. It drags at points, but over all the quality of the plot and characters shines through. And it's one of those stories where it ends being about a different journey than the one they started on, and I love those kinds of stories.

[Lon Lon Rabbit]

I picked up the first (http://www.amazon.com/Platinum-Grit-1-Trudy-Cooper/dp/1607060787/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272235584&sr=8-1) Platinum Grit (http://www.platinumgrit.com/) volume and loved it.

Man this brings me back.

My dad took me to a comic convention on a whim when I was about 8 and not especially interested in them at the time, and I met the creators of this and they gave me the first 5 or 6 issues for free, and autographed them.

I thought they were boring and confusing and threw them in a pile somewhere until I found them again at age 18 or so and fell in love with them.

I found their web publishing format unwieldy so never read the later web only issues, but am very excited about the new volumes finally coming out in paper soon.

I bought volume one but haven't read through it yet (I finally got and read through Bone, and next on the list is Scott Pilgrim which finally arrived last night), though I read my original issues to death back in high school/uni.

[LordDon]

Man this brings me back.

My dad took me to a comic convention on a whim when I was about 8 and not especially interested in them at the time, and I met the creators of this and they gave me the first 5 or 6 issues for free, and autographed them.

I thought they were boring and confusing and threw them in a pile somewhere until I found them again at age 18 or so and fell in love with them.

I found their web publishing format unwieldy so never read the later web only issues, but am very excited about the new volumes finally coming out in paper soon.

That's so awesome, Lon Lon! Trudy, the artist, was cool enough to twitter me back a couple times. I've been trying to drum her up some business because I love her work, especially Oglaf. I always look forward to some new hilariously dirty situation every Sunday. I'm hoping more Platinum Grit trades come out in the US as they're preferable to reading them online and I get to reward the creators monetarily, which always feels nice.

[zarathstra]

Also, for something completely different, Mice Templar. Its like Redwall, only badass.

[muddi900]

Mice Templar is like LOTR with Mice. Thats just fucking brilliant.

[Deadend]

Also, for something completely different, Mice Templar. Its like Redwall, only badass.

I see you your Mice Templar and raise you with a Mouse Guard. Not sure how similar the 2 are, but the 2 Mouse Guard books are pretty damn quality.

Cassanova - by Matt "I now write major Marvel comics" Fraction with art from the Brazillian Wondertwins of Ba/Moon. And spies.

Phonogram - Music, Magic and More good shit for people of quality from a Videogame Journalist/Guy who writes Thor some and Some very nice art.

Nightly News - Grim, crazy and featuring a great art style by Johnathan Hickman who is now doing major shit over at Marvel. Also the TPB has a shoutout to Evil Avatar Radio during Kefkatarn's run.

Incognito - A super-mafia goon in Witness Protection. Damn good comic and also a stepping stone between regular Super-hero stuff and Brubaker's Criminal.

Planetary - Every single issue. Possibly the most important comic series to ME, Warren Ellis at possibly his best and John Cassiddy doing amazing art.

Daredevil - Pretty much everything from the Kevin Smith Relaunch to the recent end of it has been great, the parts that SEEM bad are good and only look bad due to what's around them.

All-Star Superman - Grant Morrison's loveletter to the Man of Steel and manages to be true to the 'Classic' world of comics and also throughly modern with Frank Quitely throwing in some super-detailed art.

Ex-Machina - The Mayor of NYC has a super-power. Mostly about politics, but really more about trying to do the right thing and believe in something larger than yourself. Brian K. Vaughn writes it, Tony Harris draws it.

Starman - Also drawn by Tony Harris. A long 80 issue DC series that is unique in that is has a proper ending. Possibly the only good thing to come out of the early 90s comics.



And for something cheap and just came out?

Siege: Loki, even if you don't give a shit about Marvel's Siege. It's a good tie-alone issue. It's got it's own plot and does a better job of defining Loki than the last however many years of comics. Also he looks like such a smug bastard.

[Krispy]

Deadend, you and I have vastly different taste. I'll leave it at that. :D

[Deadend]

Deadend, you and I have vastly different taste. I'll leave it at that. :D

I wasn't going to post things already on here, as there is some quality.

But not liking Starman or Phonogram?!

[Krispy]

I actually haven't read those two. I'll definitely check them out! Right now I'm reading From Hell which is bloody amazing. Alan Moore just never ceases to amaze me at how proficient of a writer he is. Chapter 10 is perhaps the most horrifying and disturbing chunk of literature I've ever read.

[muddi900]

If we are talking good 90s comics, Joe casey's short short run on Wildcats 3.0, with Sean Phillips, was brilliant.

Speaking of Phillips, why would anyone read Incognito, when they can read Criminal. Get the deluxe edition hardcover. Its pricey but it has all the back matter from the issues, which is missing from the Trades. Also, out of print deluxe HC fetch a fortune on Ebay, so it may pay for your children's text books when it goes out of print.

[KSmitty]

Another vote for Invincible and The Walking Dead, LOVE both of those series. I still need to finish 100 Bullets (on vol 11 of 13).

I just finished Battle for the Cowl, and while I enjoyed it I think they could have continued the story for more than 3 issues. I really enjoy Fables and have every tpb out, but I think the series lost some of its steam after the end of the Evil Emporer arc. I have about half of the tpbs for Ex-Machina. I was reading DMZ, but somewhere around vol 6 or 7 I really stopped caring about the main character. Now, I am pretty much waiting for the deluge of Blackest Night tpbs that will be coming out this summer.

[zarathstra]

I'll second Ex-Machina and Planetary, especially since the final issue of the latter FINALLY came out a few months ago.

[Cactaur]

100 bullets
Planetary (finally can complete my hardcover set)
Nextwave (i generally enjoy anything warren Ellis as long as the art agrees with me)
Powers

[Deadend]

100 bullets
Planetary (finally can complete my hardcover set)
Nextwave (i generally enjoy anything warren Ellis as long as the art agrees with me)
Powers

Warren Ellis is odd, as I swear the better the artist he is paired with is, the better he writes. Which is probably why most of the Avatar stuff is kind of OKAY but not amazing. Give him JH Williams and you get the brilliant and subtle Desolation Jones. Give him some of the guys from Avatar and you get a competent but shallow story.

Which leads me to this post (http://gillen.cream.org/wordpress_html/?p=1775) by Kieron Gillen about how comic teams are a bit like bands.

[muddi900]

I'll take your Powers and raise you Alias. And Torso. And if you like movies, Fortune & Glory, which was just reprinted in a hardcover colored by Matt wilson, colorist on Phonogram(originally printed as B&W). And Ultimate Spider-man, the only spidey book to ever matter since Lee/Ditko run. Brian Michael Bendis is a safe bet as long as there is no 'Avengers' in the title.

Has anybody been reading American Vampire by Stephen King. It is not the first comic with King's name on it, but I think he co-scripts these.How are they?

Which reminds me, his son, Joe Hill, writes the best urban-fantasy comic since Sandman; Locke & Key. The storytelling is the best the medium has seen since Warren Ellis' Fell. No hyperbole.

[Pigeon]

I'm really enjoying American Vampires so far. I suggest picking it up. There's 2 stories running in the book, King does the 2nd (and so far better) one.

[Urizen]

Oh, I'm sorry. I wasn't disappointed in Sandman, exactly, but the over-arching story isn't exactly that...cohesive. Lucifer has a plot. You know what's happening, you know what has to happen, there's some sense of pace and drive. With Sandman...you stop every once in a while for some stories about some stuff. And it's great, don't get me wrong, but I really appreciated the flow of Lucifer.

So, I've read just enough of Neil Gaiman to know that I don't find his work the least interesting. But given how the critical praise for Sandman is universal, I'd like to jump head first into someone else's take on the universe. My question is this: how much do I lose if I skip Sandman and just go to Lucifer?

Can't comment on TPB's vs hardcover, but I absolutely loved the series. It drags at points, but over all the quality of the plot and characters shines through. And it's one of those stories where it ends being about a different journey than the one they started on, and I love those kinds of stories.

Duly noted. It sounds like something that belongs on my wish list.

[muddi900]

So, I've read just enough of Neil Gaiman to know that I don't find his work the least interesting. But given how the critical praise for Sandman is universal, I'd like to jump head first into someone else's take on the universe. My question is this: how much do I lose if I skip Sandman and just go to Lucifer?


Well all you need to know is that Lucifer abandoned hell, handing it over to Dream and is designed after David Bowie. At least that's what I remember from Sandman.

EDIT: Sandman is part of the DCU proper, and as are all Vertigo "stock" characters, like John Constantine. You should also give Hellblazer a try. Just don't ask me where to start.

[Urizen]

I'll throw this out there - if anyone out there likes Maus, you ought to familiarize yourself with the work of Joe Sacco. Actually, I think if you like the kind of research/scholarship that went into something like From Hell, you should check out Sacco as well.

I'm going through all his work. If you have the least interest in investigative journalism or documentary-style material and presentation, pick up anything of his. It's not a comic book - it's sequential art that tries to investigate and tell the truth.

[muddi900]

Joe Sacco has been on my list for a while. But please sir, so not say "Sequential Art". Only Will Eisner can say it and get away with that.

[Urizen]

Joe Sacco has been on my list for a while. But please sir, so not say "Sequential Art". Only Will Eisner can say it and get away with that.

I hijacked the term from a Sacco book review. So, while not they are not originally my words, I thought I'd throw them out there as bait. FWIW, I do love me some Sacco.

[muddi900]

BTW, Fox has greenlit an adaptation of Ed Brubaker's Incognito. (http://www.slashfilm.com/2010/04/29/fox-to-adapt-ed-brubakers-comic-book-incognito/)