Steam for Mac

[jeffbax]

http://www.macrumors.com/2010/02/26/valves-steam-heading-to-the-mac/

Postal 3 is supposedly coming to Mac and Linux same date release as the Windows version, so this seems to imply Source engine is running on them. Hopefully this finally results in a Mac version of Steam and at least support for Source-engine games on the platform.

It'll be nice to never have to boot camp again (not that I personally do currently)... and have to deal with WINE less (though I appreciate the strong effort by Codeweavers with CX Games)

[mightbe]

It'd be nice to see source engine titles on Macs for sure.

Hopefully a few titles will sell well and show devs that it's worth the trouble.

[KidCactus]

Episode 3 on Mac, please.

[iHap]

Episode 3 on Mac, please.

No wonder they are taking so long to finish Episode 3...

[Chris_D]

There are also a good few PC games sold on Steam that do have mac versions.

[J Arcane]

Main thing against it, is the same thing that's prevented it so many times before: Gabe is a big old Microsoft fanboy.

Remember HL1 for Mac? (http://www.planetfortress.com/syndicate/files/HLmac1.txt)

[digitalErich]

Main thing against it, is the same thing that's prevented it so many times before: Gabe is a big old Microsoft fanboy.

Remember HL1 for Mac? (http://www.planetfortress.com/syndicate/files/HLmac1.txt)
Yeah, it's not the dearth of Mac compatible games or Apple's complete disregard (in the past it was downright contempt) for gaming on the Mac platform that would make this a secondary priority for anyone with a modicum of intelligence or business sense.

[J Arcane]

Yeah, it's not the dearth of Mac compatible games or Apple's complete disregard (in the past it was downright contempt) for gaming on the Mac platform that would make this a secondary priority for anyone with a modicum of intelligence or business sense.
Did I say anything whatsoever to indicate those other things aren't factors as well?

Gabe has a bad history when it comes to supporting any platform that doesn't have the MS logo on it, that's a fact. It goes for the quality of the existing console ports, as well as their record porting their software to other platforms. He's made public statements slamming the Mac in the past. He used to work for Microsoft, for fuck's sake.

Nothing you said contradicts what I have, but every time I bring up the things you just mentioned I get attacked, so I was trying to go for one of the more audience friendly elements of the situation.

One way or another, I wouldn't get my hopes up over a couple of image files buried in a disused archive somewhere.

[jeffbax]

Gabe has a bad history when it comes to supporting any platform that doesn't have the MS logo on it, that's a fact. It goes for the quality of the existing console ports, as well as their record porting their software to other platforms. He's made public statements slamming the Mac in the past. He used to work for Microsoft, for fuck's sake.

He's certainly been vocal about Apple's apathetic game developer support in the past, but he's also been quoted on record saying that aside from games, consumers are better off buying a Mac than Vista.

There is undeniable growth of the Mac and iPhone/iPod platforms so I'm sure it is catching more than a few heads when Rage and Unreal engine support Mac and Source does not.

I mean really, if id and Epic can do it, Valve doesn't have a lot of excuses other than their own lack of effort to make it happen.

[Wraith]

http://cache-01.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9/2010/03/800x600_04_heavy_sandvich.jpg

Valve Teases Upcoming Mac Announcement, Not So Subtly (http://kotaku.com/5484948/valve-teases-upcoming-mac-announcement-not-so-subtly) (Kotaku)

[J Arcane]

You beat me to it. Though Kotaku missed the best image. From RPS: (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/03/03/valves-big-fat-hint-steam-for-macs/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+RockPaperShotgun+%28Rock%2C+P aper%2C+Shotgun%29)

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/10/feb/steamteasebig1.jpg

Maybe there's more legs to this than I thought. Sneaky bastards.

[Wraith]

That one's excellent.

I only have a MacBook that's not very game-capable (a Windows PC for gaming), but this is definitely a Good Thing™.

[Ghostbear]

Interesting. Hopefully this will encourage more devs to at least give a mac version a passing thought.

[Bone]

I always thought it was Microsoft's decision to go DirectX (effectively killing OpenGL for gaming) than anything developers chose to support. Even John Carmack was all about pushing OpenGL over DirectX. It would have simplified cross-platform gaming significantly.

[Hemalin]

http://cache-01.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9/2010/03/800x600_02_igordon.jpghttp://cache-10.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9/2010/03/800x600_03_and_i_m_a_pc.jpg http://cache-08.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9/2010/03/500x_05_francis.jpg

[J Arcane]

I always thought it was Microsoft's decision to go DirectX (effectively killing OpenGL for gaming) than anything developers chose to support. Even John Carmack was all about pushing OpenGL over DirectX. It would have simplified cross-platform gaming significantly.
Thing is though, as time went on DirectX soon became a lot more competitive than OpenGL's ludicrously slow bureaucracy could keep up with. OGL just doesn't cut it these days compared to the feature set of DX, and every time OGL promises some new version to change that, it takes the years and finally puts out something that just isn't up to mustard.

[Bone]

Thing is though, as time went on DirectX soon became a lot more competitive than OpenGL's ludicrously slow bureaucracy could keep up with. OGL just doesn't cut it these days compared to the feature set of DX, and every time OGL promises some new version to change that, it takes the years and finally puts out something that just isn't up to mustard.Completely true. Microsoft can make decisions and then implement it for their single platform. While I don't see Carmack as a god... I do usually accept that the things he considers a Good Thing are probably that way because they make wise programming choices. I have to wonder how OpenGL would have developed if it hadn't been defeated. Maybe even a gaming subset of OpenGL could have been developed for such fast-track changes while maintaining a stable release for 3D business applications.

Anyway. Good to see some love for the Mac.

[kyrieee]

I was a Mac gamer back in the 90's so I'm all for this. I just hope they won't make you rebuy games on multiple platforms

[Chris_D]

A lot of games come with both versions on the disc so I wonder how steam will work.

[jeffbax]

Thing is though, as time went on DirectX soon became a lot more competitive than OpenGL's ludicrously slow bureaucracy could keep up with. OGL just doesn't cut it these days compared to the feature set of DX, and every time OGL promises some new version to change that, it takes the years and finally puts out something that just isn't up to mustard.

Actually... you have that backward in some senses.

nVidia and ATi are free to create any driver extensions they want adding features to OpenGL - in fact, many new features hit OpenGL first because video card manufacturers can and do extend it themselves (often in those high end workstation cards... the ones used on OpenGL applications like 3D Studio Max, Maya etc), though it may take longer to hit the spec. DirectX doesn't work this way, as Microsoft controls it entirely.

DirectX's advantage in that it encompasses everything and standardizes them - graphics, sound, networking, controls. OpenGL is just a graphics library, and in many cases simpler to work in than DirectX for that purpose.

I think a larger argument for DX's success was Windows userbase, but that's becoming less compelling over time as Mac sales rise, and more users move to consoles (Hint, PS3 and Wii do not support DirectX either) Recent estimates (http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2010/03/mac-os-x-north-american-installed-base-almost-11.ars?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=rss) put Windows at 86% of online users in North America, Mac at 11%, and Linux/BSD with the remainder.

Me? I'm just happy Steam and Source are coming. If there are others great, but those are what matter most to me. I will never have to install Windows on my Mac again now.

[Doogie2K]

A lot of games come with both versions on the disc so I wonder how steam will work.

Really? I know a lot of Blizzard games do, but I've never heard of anyone else doing that.

[GigaFuzz]

Really? I know a lot of Blizzard games do, but I've never heard of anyone else doing that.

The Football Manager (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Football_Manager) games do as well (and are on Steam!), but that's the only other one can think of off the top of my head.

It'll be interesting to see if they do allow you to use multiple platforms with one purchase.

[Chris_D]

Rome: Total War
Star Wars The Force Unleashed
Sims 3
Civ 4
Dragon Age
Guitar Hero World Tour
Eve Online
Warhammer Online
Bioshock
Age of Empires 3
Battlefield 2142
COD4: MW1
Command and Conquer series
Fable
Freedom Force
Ghost Recon
Heroes of Might and Magic V
Homeworld 2
Jade Empire
The Lego games
Medal of Honor series
Neverwinter Nights 2
Simcity 4
Spore
Tomb Raider Anniversary

That's just a sampling of some of the more well known games (IMO) off Apple's site. Of course, all the recent ones are Intel chipset only (no PowerPC support). Not long after Apple changed to Intel, I believe there was a 3rd party that made a toolset available to do easy ports between Windows and Intel Macs.

Either way, there's plenty of fodder out there that could be sold on a Mac steam service.

[J Arcane]

You speak of Cider, the worst abomination ever to afflict Mac gaming. Buggy, slow, poorly supported, the equivalent of all those smartphone apps that are just J2ME apps running in crude emulators.

[Chris_D]

OK, I wouldn't know necessarily which games use or don't use it. C&C3 certainly was fine but I don't usually play games on my laptop.

[H.Bogard]

Hahah... The Force Unleashed.

I bet you need a $4000 Mac to run that.

[GigaFuzz]

I bet you need a $4000 Mac to run that.

Which is the same as a $2000 PC, amirite? lolololol.

/happy PC & Mac owner. :)

[Chris_D]

I wish I had $4000 to spend on a new mac.. mmmm (of course, I'd probably just spend $2000 on a mac and the rest on a new tv, hehe).

[Doogie2K]

[list]

That's just a sampling of some of the more well known games (IMO) off Apple's site. Of course, all the recent ones are Intel chipset only (no PowerPC support). Not long after Apple changed to Intel, I believe there was a 3rd party that made a toolset available to do easy ports between Windows and Intel Macs.

Either way, there's plenty of fodder out there that could be sold on a Mac steam service.

Oh, I don't doubt the games exist. I was just saying, putting the Mac and PC versions together is not common practice. I know for a fact all the C&C games come separately, because I've got just about all of them, and I similarly know AoE III comes separate, because I saw the Mac version in the same Amazon search as the PC version.

[Chris_D]

Sorry Doogie, misread your post.

Later versions of Quake 3 had both. Also, occassionally you could download a mac executable for use with the assets on the cd (I can't remember which game that was off the top of my head).

[jeffbax]

Dual PC/Mac games are rare at best. Would love for this to change.

[J Arcane]

Sorry Doogie, misread your post.

Later versions of Quake 3 had both. Also, occassionally you could download a mac executable for use with the assets on the cd (I can't remember which game that was off the top of my head).
It's pretty common to do this with Cider games. Cider ports are literally just a copy of the Windows version with a wrapper library and executable, so you can sometimes just make a copy of the Windows files and stuff them inside an app directory with the Cider libraries and run it.

[kyrieee]

Anyone remember when the Quake 3 beta launched on Mac first and people were really pissed off? :P

[Wraith]

"Steamworks for the Mac supports all of the Steamworks APIs, and we have added a new feature, called Steam Play, which allows customers who purchase the product for the Mac or Windows to play on the other platform free of charge," said Valve's Jason Holtman. "For example, Steam Play, in combination with the Steam Cloud, allows a gamer playing on their work PC to go home and pick up playing the same game at the same point on their home Mac. We expect most developers and publishers to take advantage of Steam Play." If that doesn't get you all kinds of giddy, then you may just be dead inside.

Steam and Valve's lineup of games (including "including Left 4 Dead 2, Team Fortress 2, Counter-Strike, Portal, and the Half-Life series") will be available to Mac users this April, but from here on out, simultaneous cross-platform releases should be the norm. "Checking in code produces a PC build and Mac build at the same time, automatically, so the two platforms are perfectly in lock-step," said Josh Weier, project lead on Portal 2. "We're always playing a native version on the Mac right alongside the PC. This makes it very easy for us and for anyone using Source to do game development for the Mac."Valve confirms Mac support for Steam and Source Engine (http://www.joystiq.com/2010/03/08/valve-confirms-mac-support-for-steam-and-source-engine/) (Joystiq)

[J Arcane]

So they're doing a proper native port, or are they just doing Cider?

Because the answer to that question could decide whether I feel arsed to get a Mac of some kind going again.

[kyrieee]

Source will be running natively using an OpenGl renderer

I wonder if they'll port the classic HL games too. I doubt the old OS9 port would work xD. I'm also curious to see how many publishers will synch your purchases across both platforms. Valve obviously will because they're Valve, but Pop Cap, for example, don't do that with their existing standalone clients. Their prices are lower on Steam though so maybe their policy there will be different.

[MagGnome]

This is definitely interesting news. I don't see myself becoming a primary Mac user anytime soon, as my Windows PC handily beats my iMac and the library of Windows games is unsurpassed. However, I'll definitely download Steam on my iMac and give it a whirl.

[Chris_D]

I own a copy of HL2 on steam so, if it carries over to Mac, then I'll definitely give it a play. Also, I'm sure there will be games in the future that I'll want to check out.

[mightbe]

The nice thing about it is that you only have to purchase a game once to have it on both platforms!