What a messed up weekend....

[Brady]

So Saturday night I went out for Sushi with a bunch of friends. One friend was running a bit late. We knew he'd be there soon so we waited to order anything. Then we get a call from him saying he was in an accident and wouldn't be able to make it. He was driving down a dark road at 9:50pm and a group of kids were out skateboarding.... They were 12-14 years old, and should not have been out on this road, its right off a busy intersection and very dark at this point in the road...

Well anyways 2 of the kids cut across the street and my friend slowed and swerved to avoid hitting them, then out of the darkness comes a third kid. Sure enough rides his skateboard out directly in front of the car while he was going 35 mph. Hits the car, hood, and on to the windshield.

When we got the call from my friend he sounded like everything was fine and told us the paramedics told him the kid just had 2 bruised ribs. The police let my friend go home after about an hour and there were not charges or citations filed against him. The other two kids did try and tell the police my friend failed to slow down and was driving with no headlights on (both completely false).

So anyways, I went on the next two days not talking to this friend... no reason, just didn't cross paths... but Monday morning I find out in the newspaper that in the end it wasn't just 2 bruised ribs and in fact the kid suffered massive head trauma from the windshield and actually died on Sunday. Nobody ever told my friend and he found out by reading his name in the newspaper....

So yeah, been a rough week for him. He is obviously devastated over the whole thing and is not sure at all what can come of this for him. Do you guys know what kind of charges they'd be able to bring against him? There still is nothing filed against him, and I know the parents could sue him if they wanted... But still it was a very poorly lit road where he wouldn't have been able to drive without headlights (proves the kids story wrong), there was absolutely no alcohol in his system, was going 10 under the speed limit when he hit the kid..... But still, nobody knows what if anything will happen to him now....

[Bingley Joe]

Oh shit.. that's really terrible, Brady.

I have no idea what kind of legal troubles your friend might be facing for something like that, but I know the best thing you can do is just be there for him (which it totally sounds like you are)..

Wish I had something more substantial than that to offer, but honestly I think having his friends and family there to remind him he's not alone is probably going to do wonders. Something like this could take him a lifetime to come to terms with.. :(

[AniAko]

If criminal charges were going to be filed, I would imagine he would have been contacted by now, but you're right to worry about civil charges, and truth be told he doesn't stand a chance :( His car insurance should cover a lot of damage for loss of life. I wouldn't do anything though until contacted.

It really sucks for you and your friend. Things like that you never truly move past in life, just always kind of deal with it. I wish you both the best and hope you can find serenity through this.

[Xerxes]

I like sooo hate kids. What the fuck are they doing out in the dark anyways.

[Generation ABXY]

I like sooo hate kids. What the fuck are they doing out in the dark anyways.

Getting hit by cars, from the sound of it.

[Xerxes]

Getting hit by cars, from the sound of it.

That's what I mean. I always seem kids doing stuff I use to do as kids, but stupidly. Like don't keep playing basketball or running after balls in the middle of the street. Don't be out when there isn't a lick or orange in the sky. If I see you hit one more mail box I'm going to kick one in the head.

[Atepsflame]

Goddamn that's awful. Its good that he hasn't had any charges filed against him, but man, it must be awful to find out about it through the papers. God, the guilt would be horrible.

[Johan]

That really is horrible. I'm so sorry.

I'm a big believer in curfews for minors. If you're too young to buy cigarettes or quit high school, you're too young to be out after dark. Get the hell home. Do some homework. Talk to your parent(s). Watch tv. Read a book. Play a game. Practice an instrument. Stay home.

[Everyone vs Dinosaurs]

That really is horrible. I'm so sorry.

I'm a big believer in curfews for minors. If you're too young to buy cigarettes or quit high school, you're too young to be out after dark. Get the hell home. Do some homework. Talk to your parent(s). Watch tv. Read a book. Play a game. Practice an instrument. Stay home.

I'm a minor, and I think that this isn't a terrible idea.


Would be nearly impossible to moderate though.

[Generation ABXY]

I'm a minor, and I think that this isn't a terrible idea.


Would be nearly impossible to moderate though.

Shoot violaters and it'll catch on quickly enough, don't you think? ;)

[Everyone vs Dinosaurs]

Shoot violaters and it'll catch on quickly enough, don't you think? ;)

Yes sir, sir.

[Rogue_hunter]

That is just horrible. I almost hit a kid on a bike recently. Wearing all black, no reflectors on the bike, not wearing a helmet, and was out after 10 pm on a Wednesday. And this kid was just riding down the middle of a main street, not even looking. All of sudden, kid decides that he's gonna turn onto the next street right in front of me. Since I was the only car on this stretch, I had my brights on, and only barely just saw the kid. I swerved like a madman, and the kid had the gall to stop, turn and flip me off.

It sounds callous and cruel, but kids that do this kind of stuff do deserve something happening to them, Darwin and all that stuff.

[Whunpo]

I'm a minor, and I think that this isn't a terrible idea.


Would be nearly impossible to moderate though.

I'm pretty sure there's a curfew in Eugene, actually. I know for a fact there's one in Portland. It's pretty late, but still it's there.
My feelings are mixed about kids being out after dark. There are a lot of idiots who could kill themselves like this. However, riding my bike at 2 in the morning (Don't worry, I'm safe. I have lights and am very traffic conscious) is one of the most enjoyable things I have had the pleasure of experiencing. It's more than possible to enjoy the night without endangering yourself or others.
However, I would support a law that gave youth an opportunity to be out at night without limits until there was evidence that they could not do it responsibly. If a parent, policeman, principal or whomever deemed it fit, they could place a curfew on certain kids who lack personal responsibility.

EDIT: Also, I want someone to come in and post a story of how some idiot kid (or possibly Dinosaur?) on a bike ran into them at a stop light about a week ago. :p

[OrangePulp]

I'm pretty sure there's a curfew in Eugene, actually. I know for a fact there's one in Portland. It's pretty late, but still it's there.
My feelings are mixed about kids being out after dark. There are a lot of idiots who could kill themselves like this. However, riding my bike at 2 in the morning (Don't worry, I'm safe. I have lights and am very traffic conscious) is one of the most enjoyable things I have had the pleasure of experiencing. It's more than possible to enjoy the night without endangering yourself or others.
However, I would support a law that gave youth an opportunity to be out at night without limits until there was evidence that they could not do it responsibly. If a parent, policeman, principal or whomever deemed it fit, they could place a curfew on certain kids who lack personal responsibility.

EDIT: Also, I want someone to come in and post a story of how some idiot kid (or possibly Dinosaur?) on a bike ran into them at a stop light about a week ago. :p

Riding really late (early) is nice, at least in this town, because you see one car maybe every few minutes. I've been out on my bike at 3, 4 in the morning, it's good stuff. But going out when it's dark, but not really late (like, say, 10:00, as in Brady's friend's case) is stupid. Very, very stupid.

Best of luck to your friend, Brady. Sounds like nothing is his fault, but it's a very shitty situation any way you slice it.

[Whunpo]

Riding really late (early) is nice, at least in this town, because you see one car maybe every few minutes. I've been out on my bike at 3, 4 in the morning, it's good stuff. But going out when it's dark, but not really late (like, say, 10:00, as in Brady's friend's case) is stupid. Very, very stupid.Running around the busy street in general is stupid. But yes, that time especially.

[JRR006]

That's terrible, I'm sorry for the kid's family, and for your friend, too. I think that knowing I'd even inadvertently taken a life would be enough to ruin mine, even if logically I knew it wasn't really my fault, just one of those twists of fate. I wish your friend well.

Criminal charges are unlikely. My friend's grandmother got struck and killed by a car near her apartment building several years ago, and as far as I know no charges were filed against the person. I think it's up to the family's discretion. Let's hope they realize that accidents - even completely terrible ones - do happen.

Also - packs of kids out after dark, on skateboards? Always bad news. Sometimes I see kids wandering or biking down the roads at night and for a moment I wish something would happen to them - not death, of course - maybe a near miss, just to wake them the fuck up. Sadly, even the most conscientious kid gets careless when they're in an energetic group.

Anyway, I hope your friend will be okay.

[DeathtollWRX]

I don't have anything really to add to this thread but I think he should get some counselling or something. This is something that what royally screw with my head and I would think that some professional help would be a good idea. It would suck if he had this guilt on this shoulders the rest of his life. Who knows how it could screw with someone.

[Everyone vs Dinosaurs]

EDIT: Also, I want someone to come in and post a story of how some idiot kid (or possibly Dinosaur?) on a bike ran into them at a stop light about a week ago. :p

In my defense, the car wasn't moving.


Wait a second... :eek:

[Whunpo]

In my defense, the car wasn't moving.


Wait a second... :eek:
Stupid kids. Giving humanity a bad name. :D

[VerseD]

This is awful, for the kid's family and your friend. It sounds like your friend did everything he could, but the trial is probably going to get really nasty for the poor guy.

[Jackel]

It is really sad how many people nowadays think that they are invincible and walk with impunity across streets. I mean I know pedestrians have a right away...but I value my life far too much to casually wander the street when anyone could be driving in a state where they might not see me. (drunk, not paying attention, tired). There are far too many accidents where pedestrians are hit through no fault of the driver.

This is not to say I don't feel for both the driver and the kid is this situation..its a terrible tragedy and I hope your friend is able to recover.

[Xerxes]

What happened to looking both way. You're pretty invincible when you are mindful of your surroundings. I remember one weekend when coming back from the club these folks wearing all black and drunk at that like walked out and then held his hands up and they was just giggling and shit. Green light and 3am. Any minor thing could have caused light out for any one of them they just having a ball. Lucky for them I was drunk and in a sobered up driving state.

I sometimes seriously think vehicular manslaughter will be how my story ends. Me as the driver that is. When reason I'd like a driver. :(

[Ancalagon]

Well, I wish your friend good luck, I hope he doesnt get any civil or criminal suit against him.

On the other side of the coin, living in London, where most people dont have cars (including me), I HATE drivers who think green means go and orange means go faster. They always push their luck, and often you find cars still in the middle of the intersection because they just couldnt wait, they just had to go. Hell, I see a lot of people going through red lights.

[Brady]

So far its looking good on the civil suit front. He still hasn't heard from anybody.... He has obviously spoken with lawyers about the matter, just in case. I feel horrible for the family, I can't imagine what they must be feeling as the kid was their only child. I really do feel for them. I just hope that they do understand that this was a complete accident and there is no reason to ruin another life with a lawsuit.

I'm pleasantly surprised at how my friend is taking it. He had a rough few days but he has definitely turned himself around and trying to put it behind him as much as he can. This is definitely a great relief as he has had a few drinking issues in the past and I really was afraid he would have turned to drinking pretty heavily this week. That fortunately has not been a problem, yet. Everyone around him has just been trying to stay positive.

[AniAko]

So far its looking good on the civil suit front. He still hasn't heard from anybody.... He has obviously spoken with lawyers about the matter, just in case. I feel horrible for the family, I can't imagine what they must be feeling as the kid was their only child. I really do feel for them. I just hope that they do understand that this was a complete accident and there is no reason to ruin another life with a lawsuit.

I'm pleasantly surprised at how my friend is taking it. He had a rough few days but he has definitely turned himself around and trying to put it behind him as much as he can. This is definitely a great relief as he has had a few drinking issues in the past and I really was afraid he would have turned to drinking pretty heavily this week. That fortunately has not been a problem, yet. Everyone around him has just been trying to stay positive.

I'm happy for you and your friend with your current status :)

As for the parents of the deceased...

My parents live on a busy highway, and I've seen more car accidents then you care to in a life time. From assholes test driving a car and killing themselves when they flipped it, to lucky mothers falling asleep at the wheel and crashing into a utility pole with her child in the car remaining unscathed.

One incident in particular haunts my memories. A woman was making a left to get off the highway, stopped waiting for the opportunity... with her wheel turned... Low and behold a man in a pickup truck behind her didn't see her and hit her van at 50mph, sending her car in front of a tractor trailer in the oncoming lane T-boning the van doing about 40-50mph as well. It slammed her van off the road and it then hit a HUGE tree in front of an office building.

That woman lost her 8 year old daughter that day. As much as I feel for her loss, the outcome of that scenario was entirely in her control. She made a mistake that cost her her daughter's life. I feel this is no different than this scenario.

This kid was obviously being irresponsible, and that led to his death. But his parents are responsible for him up until he's an adult, and they made the mistake of trusting their child's judgement about being responsible at night. The fact that the kid's friends were trying to pin it on your friend Brady proves they're all about denying accountability.

All this talk about curfews is kinda naive of you don't you think? Considering the outcome of this so far, it seems this kid wouldn't have been likley to obey the curfew (not to mention wasted police resources) and would have stood a good chance of this happening anyways.

[Johan]

All this talk about curfews is kinda naive of you don't you think?

Not if it's enforced. Curfews and parental-chaperone rules work very well when enforced. They've cured/ended gang fights at several local malls here.

[cppcrusader]

I'm a minor, and I think that this isn't a terrible idea.


Would be nearly impossible to moderate though.

Most towns/cities already have curfews for minors, you just don't realize it. I didn't discover that my hometown had a curfew until I was 16, and that was only because a cop told me.

[NoName]

That's horrible. I'm glad to hear no charges has been filed, hopefully nothing will come.

Sadly, I learned the hard way once when I was in an accident that civil charges can pop up months later. Hope for the best, but in this sue happy country I'd expect it to come sooner or later. It's good he's seen a lawyer already.

[AniAko]

Not if it's enforced. Curfews and parental-chaperone rules work very well when enforced. They've cured/ended gang fights at several local malls here.

Now THAT is naive. Just because it worked in your case doesn't mean it works everywhere, plus I doubt anyone has analyzed the negative impact enforcing such rules without prudence has had. You can't blame them, it ended what they viewed as a huge problem, it doesn't matter that it might have caused half a dozen smaller problems that now complicate other systems.

The problem isn't just with minors either. I think the problem is that we're not claiming responsibility for unruly / unsafe citizens. I've met quite a few 21 year olds that are just as big a threat (if not more because of the legality of alcohol at their age) that these teenagers were. Laws are good tools, but education / knowledge is an ace in the hole when it comes to solving problems.

[Johan]

Laws are good tools, but education / knowledge is an ace in the hole when it comes to solving problems.

I'm not naive; I'm optimistic. :) You might be a bit too "optimistic" to think that we can educate bad behavior out of people. :) Hell...we have trouble educating people to read, write and do basic math!

[AniAko]

I'm not naive; I'm optimistic. :) You might be a bit too "optimistic" to think that we can educate bad behavior out of people. :) Hell...we have trouble educating people to read, write and do basic math!

I don't think education alone will do it, but laws alone won't either. I'm a huge fan of education and law enforcement as a combined effort. Education provides accountability, and helps iron out complications before the laws get tied up our court system with frivolous defense cases. That way those who truly are just bad eggs have no excuse or defense for their actions and we can hang 'em at dawn.

[Purple Santa]

I'm a minor, and I think that this isn't a terrible idea.


Would be nearly impossible to moderate though.
Yes, moderating YOU has proved an impossible task. Look at the forums you visit and said mods trying to moderate :)

Stupid kids. Giving humanity a bad name. :D
Only EvD does. :p
One incident in particular haunts my memories. A woman was making a left to get off the highway, stopped waiting for the opportunity... with her wheel turned... Low and behold a man in a pickup truck behind her didn't see her and hit her van at 50mph, sending her car in front of a tractor trailer in the oncoming lane T-boning the van doing about 40-50mph as well. It slammed her van off the road and it then hit a HUGE tree in front of an office building.

Not so long ago I used to teach driving, including Driver's ed to teenagers. One of the first lessons as we went on the road was DON'T TURN YOUR WHEEL WHEN MAKING A LEFT TURN if you are waiting to make the turn. EVER. And the eerie thing is...I used to tell them about a woman who lost her life but left a child...I'm not sure if that was the same woman you spoke of but...gave me chills when you were stating that story. But using that story always made my point with my students. I would tell them, if you remember nothing from what I say...remember that one rule of the road...

@ the O.P.: When the paramedics said the kid only had bruised ribs, did they still take him to the hospital? Or did they just patch up the kid and leave? Often head trauma cannot be detected right away and such instances of death like in this story is not uncommon. Someone at the hospital missed something...big time...most likely if the parents are going to be after someone, it's the hospital.

I'm glad your friend is doing ok...although you might want to keep an eye on him since someone can look ok...but isn't...and with a past history of alcohol issues...stuff happens. This is one time as a friend..it pays to be in someone's business...