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Iron Past
09-06-2009, 12:49 PM
So Arkham Asylum piqued my interest in picking up some Batman TPBs, and while I have a few already--
Did Batman seriously shoot someone with a machine gun in The Dark Knight Returns?
--I was looking for more when I finish these up. Hush looks promising, especially since I love that art style and loathe the cartoony stuff most of the books I saw were in, but in looking around found two Hush books: Hush (http://www.amazon.com/Batman-Hush-Jeph-Loeb/dp/1401223176/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252262551&sr=1-2) and Complete Hush (http://www.amazon.com/Batman-Complete-Hush-Jeph-Loeb/dp/184856340X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252262551&sr=1-1).

I can't seem to find the difference, though I suspect the second one compiles all the Hush stories. Can anyone confirm? I'd just as soon wait and get more stories than piecemeal it together, but the site says nothing about the contents.

Superman's Dead
09-06-2009, 12:51 PM
Complete Hush has whatever Hush Returns in it.

Hush is great. Hush Returns is 'What The FUCK?! But Hush was SO GOOD!'

I hope that helps.

DoctorFinger
09-06-2009, 12:52 PM
Go with the regular 'Hush' book. The Complete Hush likely has a bunch of backmatter and other stories in it. In fact since it lists Paul Dini as an author, it's probably stories about Hush rather than just the 'Hush' storyline.

Blue
09-06-2009, 01:31 PM
Hush is brilliant. I would also recommend The Long Halloween if you haven't read it already. One of my personal favorites

digitalErich
09-06-2009, 01:34 PM
Hush is awesome (own the Absolute ver) but I can't think of another great Hush story/arc outside of the original. Your money is better spent elsewhere than Hush Returns.

Like Blue said, grab Long Halloween or if you want something great but kind of out there, track down a hardcover version of Bat-manga, The Secret History of Batman in Japan. It's fucking amazing. And just to reiterate, spend the money on the HC for that one.

Savok
09-06-2009, 01:52 PM
Hush was good (I'll admit it's because of my Bat/Cat shipping) until the end where it just exploded into mind numbing stupid. Even Paul Dini has trouble making Hush himself not suck.

And if you're going to loathe "cartoony" stuff, you're going to miss out of on things like DCAU love (http://pics.livejournal.com/icon_uk/pic/002r7hpe)... not that the DCAU is in trade though I don't think, because DC's trade catalogue is fucking awful.

DoctorFinger
09-06-2009, 02:02 PM
Dini's recent work with Hush has been pretty good, but everything with him between the end of the introductory arc and then has been pretty poor from what I've heard.

Wolvie
09-06-2009, 02:24 PM
All I remember about the Dark Knight Returns is:

Batman beating the snot out of and almost killing Superman with kryptonite gauntlets

He also had one of the best lines ever. Before he beats the crap out of Supes he goes "We need to talk." Then after two pages of Bats pummeling the ever loving crap out of Supes he goes "I'm done talkin, get out of my cave!" :D

Superman's Dead
09-06-2009, 02:31 PM
Batman has a line after he uses the gun, I think: "Rubber bullets."

Year One is, of course, seminal. And Batman/Superman Public Enemies has a lot of what I love about Hush.

Inspector Fowler
09-06-2009, 03:06 PM
Batman has a line after he uses the gun, I think: "Rubber bullets."

Year One is, of course, seminal. And Batman/Superman Public Enemies has a lot of what I love about Hush.

You're thinking of the Batmobile.

I think he does indeed shoot somebody with a machine gun that looks like an M60. I'm too lazy to walk to the basement and look it up, though.

Scaryfaced
09-06-2009, 03:18 PM
You're thinking of the Batmobile.

I think he does indeed shoot somebody with a machine gun that looks like an M60. I'm too lazy to walk to the basement and look it up, though.

Batman shoots a gang member with his partner's own gun, as far as I remember. No rubber bullets. No slight of hand. He just plain shoots the guy. He headshots a guy off the hip with what looks like a M60, so it was a pretty impressive shot as well. Do remember that the Dark Knight Returns is the hardcore batman book, so it sorta fits within the context.

I'm kinda in the same boat as Iron Past. The whole Battle for the Cowl storyline piqued my interest and I'm trying to catch up what Bats has been up to since I stopped reading, right around when Bane broke his back. I've also been wondering about the Hush story arch, seeing as Hush is the new Bruce Wayne if I'm not mistaken. Guess Hush will be my next batman book, but any other recommendations would be appreciated.

Xerxes
09-06-2009, 03:22 PM
I had Absolute Hush. Loved that book so fucking much.

Ultima Thulian
09-06-2009, 10:25 PM
Am I the only goddamn person on this forum who hated Hush? I love me some Batman, really do, but I hated Hush.

Superman's Dead
09-06-2009, 10:41 PM
Am I the only goddamn person on this forum who hated Hush? I love me some Batman, really do, but I hated Hush.

Yes.

tooshort

darkbase
09-06-2009, 10:44 PM
I might be alone but I'm a huge sucker for a lot of the Batman: Black and White stories. Long Halloween bored me, Hush was alright but if it wasn't for Jim Lee, I wouldn't remember liking it nearly as much I bet. TDKR is just awesome, but Strikes Back was a mindfuck -interesting- but a mindfuck. Red Son is more about Superman but I loved the Batman bit. I liked Year One because I like Gordon, didn't care for anything Bruce was going through in it, honestly. And I will argue that Gordon was even the star of that book. Batman & Son was surprisingly good, I thought... also get into the new Batman & Robin, it's really fun, you can easily find the first three issues now and anticipate #4 in a week or two.

Oh and dear God stay the fuck away from All Star Batman & Robin.

darkbase
09-06-2009, 10:48 PM
I've also been wondering about the Hush story arch, seeing as Hush is the new Bruce Wayne if I'm not mistaken. Guess Hush will be my next batman book, but any other recommendations would be appreciated.

I kinda dig how Hush is fucking things up for Dick and Damian, and I love when they decided to make a big show of force to discourage him from handing out the Wayne fortune anymore, missed what happened last week though. Anyone else here read Batman monthly?

Goddamnit this story is happening in Streets of Gotham, not Batman, isn't it? shit.

AgtFox
09-06-2009, 11:09 PM
The Hush story that sequentially happened before RIP was pretty good by Dini. Hush had plastic surgery to make him look like Bruce Wayne. Eventually Bruce caught up with him and Bruce and Dick locked him up at the top of Wayne HQ. I'll have to pickup Streets of Gotham if that is a continuation of the Hush storyline.

I loved Hush when it first came out. I have a lot of Hush collectibles from that time. It was possibly Loebs last good story until (hopefully) Captain America: White actually shows its face with Tim Sale as artist again.

muddi900
09-07-2009, 12:23 AM
Jeph Loeb is Mark Millar, without the balls. The good thing is that he gets DC characters, so Hush is like a huge blockbuster movie with Batman. If you do enjoy it though, check out Dini's "Heart of Hush" trade

Re3x
09-07-2009, 05:40 PM
Logn Halloween and Dark Victory.

Ultima Thulian
09-07-2009, 05:45 PM
No man, I'm there with you. I bought both volumes from Barnes & Nobles expecting a really intriguing story and what I got was complete fan service. Seemed like some the author just wanted a good excuse to put every Batman villain into one story arc and that's pretty much what it felt like. It was Advent Children for Batman.

I returned the books.

Thank gawd, I was beginning to feel I was the only one! I agree with your criticisms, and I'll add I hated the "plot twists" as well. It felt like M. Night Shamalamayanana-whatever-his-name-is camp.

Widgetcraft
09-08-2009, 06:14 PM
I haven't read a lot of Batman, or DC in general, but I liked No Man's Land.

Dave
09-08-2009, 07:07 PM
I liked both of the Batman: Hush books, but if I were going to recommend you to read only one Batman book, I'd say read Batman: Year One. Someone mentioned it earlier, but it's a good Jim Gordon story. Batman: The Long Halloween and Batman: Dark Victory are both really good as well too, I think.

I normally pick Batman books up via trade, but for anyone out there that's a regular reader... is there a particularly good Gotham PD book to get out there? I thought I remembered reading somewhere that there was a Batman title that dealt mainly with the Gotham police force that was pretty good; but I never looked into it. (It didn't seem like the big chain bookstores near me carried the book either.) I think it might be Gotham Central, or something like that? Anyone know what I'm talking about... or read that? I've also heard that there's one called Batman: Gotham By Gaslight that's supposed to be good too. Again, I haven't read either of these.

Any feedback on this is welcome. Thanks!

Ultima Thulian
09-08-2009, 07:21 PM
Gotham By Gaslight is part of DC's Elseworld tales, where they typically put a popular character and put them in a different place in time. I haven't read any of the Elseworld tales, but I hear the Batman ones are usually good. There's one where Batman is a pirate and kicks a shark in the head. That my friends, is win.

Psykoboy2
09-09-2009, 12:58 AM
Gotham Central.....I've read only the first issue, but I'm hooked.

muddi900
09-09-2009, 03:17 AM
Gotham Central is hands down, the best book DC has put out this decade.

DoctorFinger
09-09-2009, 08:11 AM
It's a damn shame the Gotham Central TV show never got off the ground.

Ghostbear
09-09-2009, 08:15 AM
My favorite Batman story is The Killing Joke. Also Gotham Central is fantastic.

muddi900
09-09-2009, 09:26 AM
It's a damn shame the Gotham Central TV show never got off the ground.

Well we might get the Powers show, which is just GC with more superheroes.

EDIT: The Killing Joke is great, but after reading the deluxe HC in all it recolored glory, I can see why Alan Moore, and Savok, hate it.

TheFlyingOrc
09-09-2009, 10:51 AM
Am I the only goddamn person on this forum who hated Hush? I love me some Batman, really do, but I hated Hush.

I liked Hush pretty OK, but you are more than allowed to hate anything by Jeph Loeb.

Savok
09-09-2009, 11:10 AM
EDIT: The Killing Joke is great, but after reading the deluxe HC in all it recolored glory, I can see why Alan Moore, and Savok, hate it.
"Cripple the bitch" indeed.

Also I pretty much hated Hush too, but my Bat/Cat senses overwhelm most of the hate.

Ultima Thulian
09-09-2009, 11:37 AM
I think Killing Joke is a testament to Moore's genius. If that is one of his "shittier" works, then his other works have to be utterly outstanding (and they are).

I do think Killing Joke is overrated, but I do love it nonetheless. But again, I gotta say my favorite is probably Arkham Asylum: Serious House on Serious Earth. At least for now. Dark Knight Returns is a damn close second. Love watching Supes get an assbeating near the end, and done up proper.

Ultima Thulian
09-09-2009, 11:38 AM
I liked Hush pretty OK, but you are more than allowed to hate anything by Jeph Loeb.

Jeph Loeb is the Stephen King of comics for me. When it comes to King, I find his books either utterly brilliant (Dark Tower, Dolores Claiborne, etc), or utterly shitty (Cell, Pet Semetary, etc.). Jeph Loeb is the same for me. I either love his work or utterly hate it, with no in betweens.

I also hate how his first name is spelled. It just...irks me. :p

TheFlyingOrc
09-09-2009, 11:45 AM
Jeph Loeb is the Stephen King of comics for me. When it comes to King, I find his books either utterly brilliant (Dark Tower, Dolores Claiborne, etc), or utterly shitty (Cell, Pet Semetary, etc.). Jeph Loeb is the same for me. I either love his work or utterly hate it, with no in betweens.

I also hate how his first name is spelled. It just...irks me. :p

Well, my understanding is that Loeb's work has gotten VERY strange ever since the death of his son, and corresponds to his downward slope of quality. Also, everything he writes has to have a freakin' whodunit in it.

muddi900
09-09-2009, 01:59 PM
Well, my understanding is that Loeb's work has gotten VERY strange ever since the death of his son, and corresponds to his downward slope of quality. Also, everything he writes has to have a freakin' whodunit in it.

Loeb just doesn't get Marvel characters. There is nothing more to it.

digitalErich
09-09-2009, 02:02 PM
Speaking of Elseworlds, didn't DC say (like two years ago) that they were going to bring that label back?

AgtFox
09-09-2009, 02:15 PM
Loeb just doesn't get Marvel characters. There is nothing more to it.
Whoa! Back up a bit. Daredevil: Yellow and Spider-Man: Blue are both really good. Could part of it be because Tim Sale is connected to them? Maybe.

Ultima Thulian
09-09-2009, 02:49 PM
I didn't know Loeb's son died...that's a real bummer. :(

roboninja
09-09-2009, 02:51 PM
Jeph Loeb is the Stephen King of comics for me. When it comes to King, I find his books either utterly brilliant (Dark Tower, Dolores Claiborne, etc), or utterly shitty (Cell, Pet Semetary, etc.). Jeph Loeb is the same for me. I either love his work or utterly hate it, with no in betweens.

I also hate how his first name is spelled. It just...irks me. :p

Not to totally derail but, ... you thought Pet Semetary was shitty?!?! Then again, I thought The Cell was decent too.

Ultima Thulian
09-09-2009, 04:40 PM
Dood, even Stephen King thinks Pet Semetary is shitty. :D

Widgetcraft
09-09-2009, 08:31 PM
I thought the movie was alright, for a cheesy horror movie, but I couldn't imagine reading it as a novel.

DoctorFinger
09-10-2009, 02:35 PM
Speaking of Elseworlds, didn't DC say (like two years ago) that they were going to bring that label back?
It's not happening any time soon. DC went a little overboard with the Elseworlds earlier in the decade, and they wanted to give them a rest for a while. But now Grant Morrison is working on a project called 'Multiversity' which will explore the multiverse a bit more, and until that's done DC won't let anyone else (except for Johns) play in that sandbox.

Dave
09-10-2009, 06:17 PM
Gotham By Gaslight is part of DC's Elseworld tales, where they typically put a popular character and put them in a different place in time. I haven't read any of the Elseworld tales, but I hear the Batman ones are usually good. There's one where Batman is a pirate and kicks a shark in the head. That my friends, is win.

Nice! I don't know if Superman: Red Son counts as an Elseworlds tale, but that one I really liked. There's a Batman and Dracula: Red Rain book that is drawn by Kelley Jones that I've seen at Barnes & Noble that's looked pretty cool. I've never really thumbed through it before, but Kelley Jones' artwork is great, I think. It kind of reminds me of Bernie Wrightson's work. There's a really awesome creepiness to it.

Gotham Central.....I've read only the first issue, but I'm hooked.

Cool. I don't know if that was you who told me about that, but I remember hearing that it was really good.

Gotham Central is hands down, the best book DC has put out this decade.

Interesting. Normally I'm not too into anything that DC is releasing that's not under the Vertigo imprint, but I'll have to keep an eye out for this one.

muddi900
09-11-2009, 12:59 AM
It's not happening any time soon. DC went a little overboard with the Elseworlds earlier in the decade, and they wanted to give them a rest for a while. But now Grant Morrison is working on a project called 'Multiversity' which will explore the multiverse a bit more, and until that's done DC won't let anyone else (except for Johns) play in that sandbox.

They are releasing a Batman Beyond book next year, aren't they?

Nice! I don't know if Superman: Red Son counts as an Elseworlds tale, but that one I really liked.

Yes, it is one and its Mark Millar's only work of substance. He has done other good work, but all of it is too "Flash. Bang. Kaboom. Ratatatata." Probably one of the best Superman stories of all time.

Ultima Thulian
09-11-2009, 09:03 AM
They're releasing some Batman Beyond shit? YES PLEASE.