MMO Anonymous

[Karusan]

I, like many other people on these forums and worldwide, play an MMO, more specifically for me, an MMORPG. I also, like many other people, spend a large portion of my time devoted to this MMO in the endless quest for advancement, reward and involvement in community and, simply put, am addicted. There are a few different papers on MMO’s by Yee (http://www.nickyee.com/pubs/Yee%20-%20MMORPG%20Demographics%202006.pdf) and Clark (http://gamasutra.com/features/20060822/vgsca_gama.pdf) but they’ve been out a while so I wont go into them too much (an interesting read if you haven’t had a chance) but they go into the motivations and compulsions behind MMO’s and the things that make people continue to come back. At a very basic level, you give a little, get a little, give a little more, get a little more, and that process continues until you’ve wired your brain to be dependant upon that reward and you’re investing so much time that it’s having an impact on your life outside of the game and as a result becoming an addiction.

MMO’s aren’t something new and neither is MMO addiction, but the fact that MMO’s are reaching a wider audience, the numbers on WoW is a huge indication of this, means the impact of MMO addiction is hitting a wider audience as well. Game interventions are not uncommon, and the impact of additions are huge, people lose their jobs, stop studying, cease socialising with friends, stop eating, yes these are extremes but regardless of what people want to say, MMO’s are having an impact on peoples lives and it’s only going to get worse as more and more people are introduced. I’m not having an attack at MMO’s, as I said I play an MMO and I enjoy it, I think it’s a very enjoyable source of a time kill and I’ll never forget some of the friends I have made in the process but I believe I passed that point of time kill into a world where a lot of people have fallen and have no way of getting out. This is where the previously mentioned papers have failed and further research needs to be made, how MMO/Game addiction can be brought back to a safe level.

I myself have first admitted the fact that I have an addiction. I have also started to limit my engagement to “guild events”, for me this stops me logging on every single time I get home, I’m finding other things to do with my time and I can already see that it’s having an effect. My next step if this doesn’t work is to take a break, if that fails (as it has before) I will leave completely, and if that fails, delete my character or, as bad as it might sound, selling it might be a better option as even with deleted characters there are ways to recover it.

This is where it comes to the community and the acknowledgement of the issue in general (I’m really sorry if this has been raised before) and the effect it is having on people’s lives. Across the internet, as this is the games primary medium, there is a severe lack of support for those people that WANT to stop playing an MMO, all they do find is more advertising for the game in question and then they turn back to their old habits. This is where I put out the question, has anyone tried to quit an MMO? Has anyone succeeded, what worked? What about those that tried but ended up going back, what made you go back, what should you have done differently? For those that don’t play but have friends that do, what impact can you see have MMO’s had on them as a person? Has anyone been part of an intervention?

Karu~

[Hotcod]

As ever when i read anything along these lines the simple fact is that people who get addicted to mmos to an damaging degree are simply people who are open to such addiction. Mostly it ends up being drugs or drink or any number of other things including games full stop let alone mmos... mmos just provide in a single product a way to almost unendingly feed the addiction beacuse that is how they make there money. They are set up so that they are never finished and when the player base has started to establish it's self firmly in the end game the game is expanded. This is why mmo game addictions are seen, wrongly, as something new. There not. It is just that people crave simple expiations and having one thing, one game, that is a never ending addiction is easier to relate to other addictions like drugs and booze.

I firmly believe there are people just as addicted to film, tv, games, books, or even music as there are to mmos or drugs of some kind. They are just easier to dismiss beacuse there is a turn over of 'things' involved and often its harder for them to having an as clear damaging impact...

What am i trying to get at? really it's that, yes, the number of people who get damglingly addicted to mmos will rise as the numbers rise but from the make up of those people who lose jobs, and freinds or drop out of school simply means that they where likely to get addicted to something at some point in there life and there are things a LOT more damaging than being addicted to an mmo. There is no physical addiction that is purely reliant on the game and no direct harm the gaming is doing... well maybe other that eye side and to much snack good... but so long as these people have some one to spot and help with the problem they are far better off being addicted to an mmo than say drugs or drink.

As to why they are predisposed to addcition? well this often comes from underlying issues and as such mmo addiction tends to almost always be a symptom rather than the problem. Of all the thing i've read on people who become addicted to wow to the exclusion of there life there has been something about there life that they are trying to hide, or run away from. It just happens that they have ended up in a mmo rather than in a bottle. mmos are set up perfectly for these kind of people and it means while the vast vast vast majority will not have any major problems there are a small number of people who get hooked in because they are looking for something to be hooked by.

As for you last point, you can raise it about drinking... unlike mmos drinking is part of the very fabric of our society. It's simply part of the way, to some extent, that the vast majority of people socialise. Which is exactly why there is such suppourt for these kind of people... since it's much harder to get away from.

If you addicted to a mmo there just seems to have to be a time when you cut your self off from the internet... just like some one who is trying to stop drinking might want to avoid going in to bars for a while... but in the end it's a relatively small number of people from the millions who play, say, WoW who have major problems with it which is why there is so little suppourt out side of your family and freinds and that is unlikely to change.

so, what dose that all mean? mmo addiction is a real and horrid problem and while mmos are set up in such a way that it will hook in some one predisposed to be addicted to them the simple fact is that that predisposition is going to lead them to be addicted to something most of which are much worse for them than playing WoW. It's in the end an small issue that has to be dealt with by the people around them and while the community should be sensitive to this issue it is, in the end, not the communities responsibility...

[Karusan]

Being someone that has been exposed to drugs/alcohol and not having become addicted I don’t believe it’s as simple as “a personality” thing, that I am the type of person that latches onto addictive activities. Having been in that scene I would also say that not all cases of being addicted to drugs and alcohol can be deemed as worse for you than being addicted to games/mmo’s. The difference being that it’s a lot easier to get yourself killed on drugs and alcohol than it is from playing games and that drugs and alcohol have a clinical label of addictiveness. I also feel some context needs to be put into this comparison between drugs and games, drugs have been around for centuries, it is something that has been built into our culture, games on the other hand haven’t been around for long at all, let alone MMO’s being around for less than 2 decades. Also, the reason we do have things like rehab for alcohol and drug abuse is because there’s money in it. Insurance companies and Governments spend more on the effects of drug and alcohol than they would like to and the simple fact is prevention is better that cure, if you can make money out of it in the process even better. The reason there’s no attention brought to gaming addiction is the question, who is going to make money out of rehab for gaming addiction? The answer being no one, it’s a loss of money, so of course no one is going to invest in it. Blizzard didn’t get rich by telling people not to play their game.

In terms of drinking being the social norm, I think you’ll find that MMO’s and gaming general are becoming the social norm and that’s part of my point. From memory some survey had 90% of children playing games, and as they said on In-Game Chat, soon America will have a President that grew up playing Video Games. Going off exactly what you said, “It's simply part of the way, to some extent, that the vast majority of people socialise.” Video Games (and I’m increasingly moving away from MMO’s in general it seems) are becoming a huge social part of our lives, consumers and the community want games that have Co-op or online play, they want to play with their mates, they want an environment where they can socialise, they want to be connected and at the same time choose not, 360 has been so successful because its created a massive community of online gaming that has reached the masses. As I said, it’s only going to get bigger.

While you say it’s not the communities responsibility I agree and disagree, people should be responsible for themselves however some people don’t know how, nor do they know how to help themselves or realise that they may have a problem. The community for a lot of the part is the reason people are there in the first place, again, this is part of the reason WoW is so successful but as I said, Blizzard isn’t going to help people stop their game and if Blizzard isn’t then who is? I feel that the community does need to take some responsibility for it. How many times have I heard people say “game > rl” or something to that effect. If the community doesn’t want responsibility then they’re at least doing the wrong thing for those that do want help. Relating back to drugs and alcohol, people take them because they’re exposed to them through friends or whatnot and continue to take them because of the mental rewards associated with that experience and eventually they will reach a point where it becomes normal for them to keep taking them because it has affected their mental thinking. Now who has the responsibility for that person? The person that introduced them to the drug in the first place? The friends that take the drugs with them when they go out? The maker of the drug? The family and friends that may not even know what’s going on? Or the Government that has to deal with another dead body because they didn’t put something in place to prevent it from happening? No one wants to take responsibility but everyone has some, similarly to games, the community just wants to wipe their hands of the issue and let someone else deal with it.

I guess what I’m trying to say is that for some people they do have problems, and until it happens to someone you love or one of your friends you may not care but regardless there is still an issue within the gaming community that will only get worse. Games aren’t bad, we all know that, but unless some responsibility is taken for those around us then more negativity will be thrown at the gaming community. I just don’t want to be having the conversation with someone in 20 years time saying how my mates kid OD’d on some game and died, as stupid as it sounds technology is progressing and who knows what’s going to happen.

[JRR006]

Relating back to drugs and alcohol, people take them because they’re exposed to them through friends or whatnot and continue to take them because of the mental rewards associated with that experience and eventually they will reach a point where it becomes normal for them to keep taking them because it has affected their mental thinking. Now who has the responsibility for that person? The person that introduced them to the drug in the first place? The friends that take the drugs with them when they go out? The maker of the drug? The family and friends that may not even know what’s going on? Or the Government that has to deal with another dead body because they didn’t put something in place to prevent it from happening? No one wants to take responsibility but everyone has some, similarly to games, the community just wants to wipe their hands of the issue and let someone else deal with it.


I agree with your idea that everyone should look out for their fellow man, but at the same time - what do you expect the community to do? Alerting someone that they have a problem is good and the admirable thing to do, but what is the next step in, for instance, a case of MMO addiction? Actively shunning them, kicking them out of the guild?

The community at large shouldn't act as a nanny or babysitter - that way lies danger, and that responsibility resides in each individual person. Maybe I'm not fully understanding the role you think the community should take.

I don't see how guildies can be implicated in someone's MMO addiction, if that's what you're getting at. They're there to play the game, not babysit another player who should be an adult. Recognizing someone is sick and trying to get them some help is the decent thing to do, but at the same time we are not entitled to be coddled every waking moment of our lives to keep us from falling into temptation. Those who can't control themselves... well, what are we to really do about it, as a society? Medicate them? Lock them away so they can't harm themselves through unhealthy behavior?

I agree that there should be communities for recovering MMO addicts, places where they can get support and commiseration. Who will form those communities? Those who need them, I imagine. It's no one else's responsibility.

[Karusan]

I guess I’ll try reiterate my original question since this is the important part of what I’m getting at:
What are processes or steps that people have found successful for cutting back or stopping MMO play where they have reached the point of abuse?

I completely agree though, blame doesn’t go to guildies, it shouldn’t, they’re just playing their own game. I don’t know what the next step of addiction would be, that’s why I’m putting it out for discussion. What I do know is that the issue isn’t given enough credit, it isn’t even put out there that games (particularly online) can be negatively life changing, it is that issue I feel the community needs to have some involvement in.

Think of a time when one of your friends has said, “I’m going to quit”, almost the first reply is always “No”. That might have been a cry for help and our first response was to dismiss it because if your friend leaves then your game experience is reduced. Again, I don’t think guildies should be blamed but they do have a part in it, their response is based on their own game, not the thoughts or feelings of the friend that’s leaving. Some people would be able to stop if it weren’t for the friends they were involved with and they guilt they would feel if they left, which is sometimes also imposed on them by the community they’re in. This isn’t as a result of the community itself but a direct result of the way online games have developed. Were the community more, I’ll say admitting and understand, of the issue the first response might not be “No” but might be something along the lines of finding out why and then offering support in leaving.

So no, I don’t think it’s anyone’s fault that someone got addicted other than the person that got addicted in the first place, be it for physical or psychological reasons. I also don’t think it’s the communities responsibility to identify the issue with people. What I do feel is that the community needs to support those that want out, which isn’t always happening, nor do those people have somewhere to go if they don’t have someone to support them. There’s not even any education in the fact that games can be addictive and the negative effects of games (On the flip side of this there isn’t nearly enough education on the benefit of games either).

In terms of what we can do as a community right now, we can not say “No” to those that want to leave. While it might seem like something simple, it might be something simple that has a really big effect.

[VerseD]

If you're worried about MMO addiction, you should quit playing. It's that simple. At least force yourself take a month off and find new ways to spend your time. I guarantee you either won't go back or you'll severely mitigate the time you spend playing.

Tell your guild mates that you're taking a month off for personal reasons. If they have a problem with that then they're not really your friends and don't have your best interests in mind. It may seem like you're abandoning a community, but since you started playing you've been neglecting real life relationships for online ones which can never be as fulfilling.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, but I've been there. You'll feel much better about yourself once you get off WoW.

I firmly believe there are people just as addicted to film, tv, games, books, or even music as there are to mmos or drugs of some kind. They are just easier to dismiss beacuse there is a turn over of 'things' involved and often its harder for them to having an as clear damaging impact...

Alcohol and drugs are addictive. They change your physiology so that you physically need them.

MMOs don't do that, but players can become develop a psychological need for them, especially if they have a history with substance abuse or a family history with addiction. They provide a release from the stress of reality, and it's easy to fall into a rut where that seems like the only thing that matters.

This means that MMOs are relatively easy to quit if you have a little willpower. When you want to play, DON'T. Go on a walk, join a knitting group, take a class, read a book, do anything else, please.

[Hotcod]

Well that the point people who are not predisposed to addiction can become physically addicted to drugs and alcohol where as there simply has to be an underlying reason for the mmo addiction beacuse the hook is purely mental so to speak.

But Karusan, you seem to misunderstand the point i was trying to make. I wasn't saying with out a doubt that some one addicted to an mmo will get addicted to drink or drugs if they are exposed to them, i'm just saying that given the trend of what to seem to be the same underlying problems in mmo addicts as other addicts it's just the case that these people are simply more at risk of becoming addicted to something. As for mmo being able to wrose than a drink or drugs addiction, well, the worst mmo cases i've read about have been the average for say a alcoholic... until, like a friend of mine, mmo addicts turn to prostitution to keep there habit going that leads to more addictions and more self hate that leads to suicide... well... excuse me if i happen to think on the sliding scale of 'bad thing' £15 a month and a lot of your time with no other physical side effects isn't that awful.

And i'm sorry but let look at who is responsible for my friend, of course the people who sell her the drugs and employed her as an escort are but they are also people who don't care.... there are the people that did drugs with her or brought sex off her... again they are responsible and they don't care... her freinds and family tried very hard to help but there was in the end not much we could do.

In terms of mmos there simply isn't even close to that much social culpability, the people who make that game? given that the game is not inherently addictive they are less responsible than any one who makes alcohol... the people who play? the vast majority won't even know, even guild mates may not see what is going on and past the point of try to tell the person they have a problem what are they expected to do? they are playing a game for entertainment and to relax and to escape and paying for the privilege and you are expecting them to act as a support group for some one they don't know... it's ridiculous and is never going to happen... freinds and family are simply the only people who can really do anything to help and who every is paying the bills... while, like i said, the community needs to be sensitive there is nothing they can or even should do...

Unlike drinks and drugs it's unlikely the person will go in to such a downward spiral that they end up dead in some way... they need money so if they've lost a job the money must becoming from somewhere and if it isn't and they lose there job it will run out...

so, to leaving... if you want to leave beacuse you understand you have a problem then you really really need to talk to some one in real life who can take useful real steps to help you... there is nothing what so ever that the community should be expected, or even can, do.

[kropotkin]

An interesting thread to say the least and one I feel compelled to respond to given my own experience with successfully leaving WoW in the February of this year.

Towards the end of 2007 the guild I was in and officer of was having difficulties taking on the final bosses in both Tempest Keep and Serpentshrine Cavern. Guild killers they were known as at the time and they really broke our collective backs.

After repeated attempts guild morale was hitting an all time low. The guild master quit and a new, less effective one took his place. At the time I was looking after recruitment, DKP allocation and raid leading. It was like a second job only it was more stressful than my real one!

So one Sunday afternoon as I was gathering herbs for potions to make for the evening's raid I decided I had to stop. I was mulling over how to make things better for me in WoW and the guild and it always came back to the same thing, stop. Just freaking STOP. So I did. Sadly the manner in which I did so was not what I'd recommend to anyone...

You see I did not converse with any fellow officers of my intent. I carried on as if nothing was amiss and lead the evenings raid as normal. We made it to the penultimate boss in SSC and I ended the raid. I then immediately said my goodbyes and /gquit. The fallout was torrential but thankfully short lived. At the time of my leaving I essentially held the guild's infrastructure together. Frantic messages were sent between me and my former guild officers as I passed on my responsibilities to them. Minutes after I quit the game and uninstalled it without hesitation. I posted a goodbye message on the guild's forums and moved on.

Many, many bridges were burnt thanks to my actions. I have little to no contact with the people I played with for over 2.5 years. My only regret was the manner of my leaving but I had a moment of clarity on that Sunday afternoon and I had to act on it, so I did.

Since then I've been playing many other games and even other MMO's such as Age of Conan and now Warhammer Online. Neither can hold a candle to WoW in my opinion which is both its strength and, for me, danger. WoW is an amazing game that has yet to be bettered in the MMO genre. It is for this reason that I can never return to it for fear of it sucking me in once again.

As to how I shrugged off WoW and moved on to playing MMO's casually, such as WAR it's was just a case of recognising that it was causing me stress and acting on that source of stress.

By the way, the guild I was in killed Illidan 6 months after I quit so my leaving did not weaken them in any way. If anything they needed to reinvigrate themselves by installing a new council which they did.

I hope this has gone some way in answering your original query.

[QueQueg]

I don't have an addictive personality in any other aspect of my life. I drink occasionally, have done drugs in the past, and neither of those things became any more than a passing distraction.

MMO games are a completely different story. When I start playing a new MMO, I just get completely obsessed with it. The more depth, skill trees, crafting, exploration, the deeper my obsession. It's like I have to see it all, experience it all. If I get involved in any kind of guild (which is inevitable), it's pretty much all over.

The relationships that form in-game, even fleeting one-off pickup-groups, become as important as any in the "real" world. The line is blurred, and I start feeling responsible to the people I meet in the game, like I owe them some of my time. A competition forms between the real people in my life (myself, my wife, and my son) and the people I interact with in-game. Joining a raiding guild in WoW damn-near ended my marriage. It's these virtual relationships that are the most insidious part of MMOs. I'd think to myself "the game is still going, people are enjoying it without me." The compulsion to login just to see whats happening became overwhelming.

I tried cutting back on my play-time. I tried setting a limit to the number of hours/week that I would play. I tried limiting my play to raid nights (never works, because of the amount of solo prep required to really participate.) Eventually, I had to just quit, cold-turkey.

Now I realize that I just can't play MMOs anymore. I'm really sad about it, because I love them. I love the attention to detail, the hidden places, the epic rewards, and the joy of cooperatively exploring other peoples imaginations.

Unfortunately, I love them too much.