Tom Clancy novels

[Doogie2K]

The real Tom Clancy novels, not to be confused with Tom Clancy's(TM) novels, which I've tried one or two of and am decidedly ambivalent about.

Anyway, I'm looking to get back into them after being turned off by the brutality of Without Remorse (yes, I know pimps are often really monsters; you didn't need to get into it quite that much) and the mind-numbingly bad pacing and overall writing of Red Rabbit (how do you fuck up a story about a Soviet defector unveiling a secret plan to assassinate the Pope? HOW?!). My question is, where is the dividing line between "good Tom Clancy" and "bad Tom Clancy"? For reference, I've read the early Jack Ryan books (Patriot Games, Hunt for Red October, Cardinal of the Kremlin) and Red Storm Rising, and liked all of them quite a bit.

[total]

I was going to suggest both Red Storm Rising and The Hunt for Red October but it looks like those are covered. They were good books but not really my type of thing. I will ask my father tonight when I get home for some suggestions. That man has literally read damn near the entire war/fiction/historical sections in our local library (he goes through about a novel or so a day). I know one series he raves about is the "Prey," series by John Sandford. It isn't Clancy, but according to him it is quite a bit better.

[Wilkz07]

I think Clancy is done. Has been since he branded himself - I did like Endwar (prequel to the game) but it was pretty shallow. I remember Teeth of the Tiger was pretty good, stopped reading his stuff after that.

Why not give Clive Cussler a try. Specifically the Dirk Pitt novels. Sure there have been a couple of bad movie attempts - Sahara and Mediterranean Caper, but the books are great: best to read in order
The Mediterranean Caper
Iceberg
Raise the Titanic!
Vixen 03
Night Probe!
Pacific Vortex!
Deep Six
Cyclops
Treasure
Dragon
Sahara
Inca Gold
Shock Wave
Flood Tide
Atlantis Found
Valhalla Rising
Trojan Odyssey
Black Wind
Treasure of Khan

Sahara is one of my favourite books.

Another great Cussler book is The Chase - set in 1906 and using a new character Issac Bell is a story about an inspector tracking down a train robbery. Great read, couldn't put it down.

Give up on Clancy, switch to Cussler.

[CES]

Cussler is no better than Clancy when it comes to story and characters. Both seem to like predictable stories and flat characters. That said, you know what you're getting when you read one of their books which is a good thing, I guess.

Both authors are absolute masters at creating an ideal traveling book: lengthy, time consuming and ultimately empty so it's not bouncing around in your brain once the journey is over.

[Disgustipated]

I think Clancy's best novel is Rainbow Six. I found it to be fast-paced, exciting, and with some great twists and characters. All of his other novels are good, but to me, Rainbow Six is definitely the height of his work. It doesn't get bogged down like his other tomes.

[Karak]

I think Clancy is done. Has been since he branded himself - I did like Endwar (prequel to the game) but it was pretty shallow. I remember Teeth of the Tiger was pretty good, stopped reading his stuff after that.

Why not give Clive Cussler a try. Specifically the Dirk Pitt novels. Sure there have been a couple of bad movie attempts - Sahara and Mediterranean Caper, but the books are great: best to read in order
The Mediterranean Caper
Iceberg
Raise the Titanic!
Vixen 03
Night Probe!
Pacific Vortex!
Deep Six
Cyclops
Treasure
Dragon
Sahara
Inca Gold
Shock Wave
Flood Tide
Atlantis Found
Valhalla Rising
Trojan Odyssey
Black Wind
Treasure of Khan

Sahara is one of my favourite books.

Another great Cussler book is The Chase - set in 1906 and using a new character Issac Bell is a story about an inspector tracking down a train robbery. Great read, couldn't put it down.

Give up on Clancy, switch to Cussler.

THis
/thread

Outstanding books. Just outstanding.
Dragon is so amazing.
One of the things I love is learning so much from Cussler books. His way of dealing out vital and real information in the source of the story is amazing. Flood Tide ended up causing a 2 hour discussion at work just a couple months ago. Great times.

[Zecon]

I think Clancy's best novel is Rainbow Six. I found it to be fast-paced, exciting, and with some great twists and characters. All of his other novels are good, but to me, Rainbow Six is definitely the height of his work. It doesn't get bogged down like his other tomes.

Quoted for truth,
although this is the only clancy novel I have actually read.
well splinter cell, but I'm pretty sure he didnt write that.

[BlackPete]

Why not give Clive Cussler a try. Specifically the Dirk Pitt novels. Sure there have been a couple of bad movie attempts - Sahara and Mediterranean Caper, but the books are great: best to read in order
The Mediterranean Caper
Iceberg
Raise the Titanic!
Vixen 03
Night Probe!
Pacific Vortex!
Deep Six
Cyclops
Treasure
Dragon
Sahara
Inca Gold
Shock Wave
Flood Tide
Atlantis Found
Valhalla Rising
Trojan Odyssey
Black Wind
Treasure of Khan



Thanks so much for posting this list. It really wasn't clear which one was the "first" Dirk Pitt novel, and I thought Raising the Titanic was it (which I bought). Now I see that I'll have to rectify that error before fully committing myself to Cussler. :D

I also read a couple of James Rollins books, which are entertaining as well (with a couple of flaws). I liked the fact that he was described as "Not quite as good as Cussler, but has a solid grip on second place" in his own books. :D

[BlackPete]

Oh yeah, and on Clancy... I read a couple of books, and was hooked until I realized they were basically following a formula: Dull for the first half while events are being set up and put into place, then shit hits the fan for the last 3/4 of the book, with the real conclusion taking up maybe 10 pages at the end.

[Inverarity]

Dull for the first half while events are being set up and put into place, then shit hits the fan for the last 3/4 of the book, with the real conclusion taking up maybe 10 pages at the end.

Well, to be fair, that can be said of an awful lot of novelists. In fact, plenty of novelists whose work I really enjoy are far more guilty of this than Clancy (Neal Stephenson, to name one).

I thought that The Hunt for Red October and Red Storm Rising were both decent books, for different reasons, but after that things kind of fell off a cliff. Red October is by far his most tightly written piece of prose, and to my mind it shows what a lot of editing and revision can do for his normally overblown stories. Red Storm Rising is a nice, hugely detailed piece of speculative writing - it shows that it was an idea for a wargame campaign before it was a book - and is probably his only novel where the length of the book (700+ pages) matches the scope of what's happening.

[BlackPete]

Well, to be fair, that can be said of an awful lot of novelists. In fact, plenty of novelists whose work I really enjoy are far more guilty of this than Clancy (Neal Stephenson, to name one).

This is true. I can put up with that for most books, except Clancy's books tend to be massive. So the first 1/2 of the book (that sets up stuff, etc.) are easily 500+ pages, which is easily a book length by itself. It got exhausting after a while and I decided to stop bothering.

I thought that The Hunt for Red October and Red Storm Rising were both decent books, for different reasons, but after that things kind of fell off a cliff. Red October is by far his most tightly written piece of prose, and to my mind it shows what a lot of editing and revision can do for his normally overblown stories. Red Storm Rising is a nice, hugely detailed piece of speculative writing - it shows that it was an idea for a wargame campaign before it was a book - and is probably his only novel where the length of the book (700+ pages) matches the scope of what's happening.

Actually I agree with this. Clancy's books definitely needed a lot of tightening up by a decent editor. It's sad that when an author became rich and famous, then editors tend to have more of a hands-off approach to their future books.

[Wilkz07]

The Mediterranean Caper was really hard to find. I managed to pick it up and dirty old used book shop. Though it may have been reprinted, at the time I read it, it was out of print.

I tried to read the books after Black Wind but just couldn't get into it. I was used to Dirk and Al and just couldn't believe the same adventure with Dirk Jr and his 'Al-counterpart' friend.

Cussler books are good traveling books as CES said. I find they are fairly quick reads and entertaining. I tend to not read books for fact or lengthy discussions.. Hell, I'm reading Breathers: A Zombie's Lament now lol.

If you want good, quick cottage country books check out James Patterson's Alex Cross Series.

* i also recommend Cussler's The Chase.

[Crowe]

Rainbow Six was arse kicking. Read a few times now, I think its time for a new one. The games definitely need a rest.

[Doogie2K]

So I guess getting back to the original question...mind the page count? Stop after Rainbow Six? Like I said, I read Red Rabbit, and that was crap, but I don't know where Clancy lost the plot to begin with.

I also plan on seeing if I still have my dad's old Ludlums. I could go for reading the original Bourne trilogy, now that I have some distance from the movies.

[Bad Buddha]

The Bannerman books by John R. Maxim (https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=Paul+Bannerman+John+R.+Maxim&x=13&y=16)are pretty intense and a good read. A bunch of retired assassins and spies try to retire but the government keeps trying to pull them back. Bloodshed ensues!

I'm also a big Clive Cussler fan. The books are a bit formulaic, but they're a good read and lots of fun. Sometimes that's all I want from a book.

I just picked up Corsair at Half-Price Books yesterday! :D

[total]

I also plan on seeing if I still have my dad's old Ludlums. I could go for reading the original Bourne trilogy, now that I have some distance from the movies.

I absolutely loved this series. I thought the movies did a pretty good job too. I'm also one of the few that enjoyed Eric Van Lustbader's Bourne books also.

[GunnyMo]

I'd have to agree with the others that early Clancy is excellent and anything else is bleah. :) But the original Bourne trilogy is also most excellent.